Fish Compatability!!!

[masoud100]

Alright guys the tests that were done were by Big Als and they said everything is fine so I assumed everything was 0. But just came back from work and realized I had the test kit of water hardness, nitrate and ammonia. I did ammonia first and it was 0. Then I did nitrate at first looked 0, but after reading the manual it said wait 5 min and then check it against the chart. Well I did and it was measured at 5 out of a possible 110 I believe. So I am assuming everything is good.

Now referring to the chart. The chart makes almost no sense at all. If you look at it as a graph with x-axis and y-axis. Whether you start from the x-axis or y they contradict eachother or its incomplete. Like for Barbs if you follow the top part it says its compatable with Gouramis (so why did previous member say its not after posting this link to follow)? Second if you look at it from the side view Barbs it says C C C C C Y and then rest is blank. Why

I am not planning on adding fish until sometime 1-3 weeks from now due to saving up money for other reasons. Also by next week plan on buying easy plants and some java moss before any new fish is added.

Java Moss is a ball shape thing (but someone said to tie it around my driftwood?

So can someone tell me what fish I should have with Tiger Barbs, and Red Tail Black Shark and Hillstream Loach? I want someone to give me an input of what would look nice. I am thinking of selling my Bala Sharks.

[dpatte]

barbs, loaches and sharks are all asian fish, and do well together. i would add siamese (2-3) and chinese (1) algae eaters.
Then if you must add other fish, there are alot of nice barbs. Perhaps black ruby barbs or gold barbs.
keep your water around 25C/75F

[sylros]

Now referring to the chart. The chart makes almost no sense at all. If you look at it as a graph with x-axis and y-axis. Whether you start from the x-axis or y they contradict eachother or its incomplete. Like for Barbs if you follow the top part it says its compatable with Gouramis (so why did previous member say its not after posting this link to follow)?

Java Moss is a ball shape thing (but someone said to tie it around my driftwood?)

So can someone tell me what fish I should have with Tiger Barbs, and Red Tail Black Shark and Hillstream Loach? I want someone to give me an input of what would look nice. I am thinking of selling my Bala Sharks.

As barbs are usually more aggressive than not, fin nipping and such, hence none with long fins and pearl gouramis have long fins. It will all depend on the setup of your tank as well, if there are lots of hiding places that will help. There's also something about having the right number of fish. It was true with my serpae tetras, if less than 5, they just nip at everybody but now that I have 5 they just leave everyone alone. There's the size of the fish as well, either same size of bigger than them.

If it's in a ball, you must be talking about morimo balls, stuff will get caught into those if there's too much in the tank. If you didn't want to keep it as a ball, I've seen it attached to driftwood looking pretty neat!

I agree with going with Asian type of fish, that's another way to choose compatible fish.

[masoud100]

Regarding the ball thing I am talking about heres a link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeRj7JntLLQ

They sell that in all PetsMart stores and what do you mean stuff will get caught in it? The Petsmart girl told me that they will also help algae on your glass come off cuz its like a magnet.

So right now I got 10 Tiger Barbs, 10 Green Tiger Barbs, 1 Red Tail Black Shark, 3 Bala Sharks and 1 Hillstream Loach. I might get rid of the bala sharks. I used to have a big (8 inches or so) Chinease Algea eater but it would always ruin my plant setup and always hiding with the current tank mates I have. It was always picked on by the tiger barbs.

But say I get 3 small Siamese Algae eaters and add them to my tank first. What about Black Ghose Knifefish? I love how they look and I can get a decent size right now that is about 4-5 inches. Once it reaches too big for my tank I will give it to my friend who has a 120gallon or sell it to the store.

[Nerine]

you use the moss ball to wipe the glass with? It's easier to use a real magnet...but the moss ball is a good idea because it won't scratch the glass...

[masoud100]

No the moss ball/morimo ball just lays in the tank (bottom) and it is used like a magnet pulling algae off the glass. Thats what the girl said to me at Petsmart

[Fishnut]

Masoud100, do you read anything before you buy plants, fish or anything related to your aquarium?

That is THE MOST hilarious thing I have ever heard anyone say in regards to something that is added to the aquarium!!!!!!

Find someone else to talk to for the sake of your poor fish tank!  Wow...you have got a lot to learn.

Your barbs are going to kill the knife fish but you might have known that if you had picked up a book or simply typed it into google.

[Nerine]

ooh haha I thought that is what you meant but I wasn't sure

Marimo balls NEED agitation...they cannot lay on the bottom of the tank...if they don't tumble about then they won't grow and they will die. So make sure it 'dances' about your tank

It won't pull off algae off the glass!! they also need low light

[masoud100]

Well I use aqadvisor and when I put a Blackghost knife fish it didnt say its not compatable with tiger barbs. It just says it is not suited for your tank may eventually outgrow.

Plus I wasnt planning on buying it before knowing for sure. Also I do read and see, and everything conradicts each other. Like 2 yrs ago I had Bettas and I had all females about 14 of them in my 30 gallon tank never fought or anything. People said dont put them together.

Also to Nerine how would you them make Marimo balls dance? And if I have strong light will it die

[Fishnut]

Japanese Moss Balls.  Google it.  They're not easy.  You'll need to get creative to agitate the moss balls.  They need to be like tumbleweeds in the desert.  

Black ghost knife fish.  Again...google the fish.  Learn about it's behavior and requirements as an individual species, then learn about the behavior and requirements for the other fish in your tank as individual species.  From there you SHOULD be able to figure out compatibility without relying on some online software telling you what to do.  Really...what does software know about mixing fish?  I googled Black Ghost Knife Fish and did not find too many contradicting pieces of information.  The more you read about different species, the more you'll find RELIABLE websites.  If all you're finding is contradicting info then go to fish shops and browse the books.  Heck, Chapters has books about fish!  

When you've read everything you can read about a fish (or plant), THEN go to the fish shops and ask.  THEN you seek advice in on-line forums  like this one.  If you don't even know the basics, you're never going to be successful.  You'll never know if someone is just telling you something to sell you something, giving bad advice or if they truly know what they're doing.  For example, someone out there has convinced you that a 0 reading for all water parameters is good.  You have been told repeatedly here that this is not true.  Researching the nitrogen cycle should have clued you into the fact that 0 on all parameters is not good and not possible.  Someone out there sold you bala sharks for a tank that can not hold them for very long...bad advice.  Researching the bala shark before purchasing would have clued you into the fact that they are not suitable for the tank.  Someone out there sold you an apisto, which your tiger barbs likely killed.  If you had learned about tiger barbs as a species and apistos as a species, you would have saved yourself the money for the fish and the poor fish's life.

See...whoever is giving you this advice is leading you down the path of a sucker...to aquarium keeping disaster after spending a lot of money.  If you had taken the time to thoroughly research the topic you want to learn about before moving forward with it, you would have avoided being suckered into all these incorrect decisions.

I know OVAS is a pretty good source of info because I've been keeping fish for such a long time that I can tell most of the people here are right on the money with their answers.  I also go to meetings and talk to a decent number of them.  As you've seen we're not shy about saying something even if it's not what you want to hear.  Read and understand as much as you can on your own, then seek help in filling in the blanks.  Be open to the fact that you just might have gotten some bad advice from somewhere else.  If you make a habbit of fluffing off the advice from the experienced fish keepers here, they'll stop helping and let you sink yourself.

When you get ridiculous advice like you did about 0 ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates as well as the laughable advice you got about the moss ball, never return to shop at or seek advice from that place!  

I seriously don't know HOW some business owners can sleep at night knowing the advice their employees are giving customers.

[sylros]

The easiest thing for you is to come to one of our meetings and talk to real fish keepers. We also have some books to lend out if you can't afford to buy some. There's nothing like a book instead of the internet, pick one that you understand and stick with it.

Setting up a tank is a lot of research and it's easy to mix up facts but it needs to be done.

The next one is October 22nd, try and make it.

[masoud100]

Ya regarding bad advice. Before buying Apisto I told the guy would it go with my bala sharks, tiger barbs, etc. He said ya because they are all community.

And to come to the meetings do I need to be a member? I am thinking of my final stocking list to comprise of

10 Tiger Barbs
10 Green Tiger Barbs
1 Red Tail Black Shark
3 Siamese Algae Eaters
1 Golden Algae Eater


maybe keep my 1 HillStream Loach
and add possible some Cherry Barbs

any opinions

[Fishnut]

The question is...do you think this is a compatible list? If so, why?

No, you do not have to be a member to come to meetings but you do need to be a member to borrow books from the library, win door prizes and more.  Members also get discounts at some of our sponsor fish shops.  $20...that's all it takes to be a member.

[masoud100]

so for $20 what do I get? Also is it once yearly or monthyl $20? From my perspective I think the stocking is good

[Fishnut]

Well if you have done the proper research on the species of fish and how they interact and you feel confident that you're not sacrificing the lives of the fish by making poor choices (balas and apisto for example), then theoretically, you have nothing to worry about, right?  Are you SURE cherry barbs will be OK in that tank?

$20 for the year for a membership.

[masoud100]

Yes I think Cherry Barbs should be compatabile in my tank as I got Tiger Barbs (same family), and Red Tail Shark who will keep to himself in his area with future additions of SAE and Golden Algae Eater

[robt18]

I wouldn't add cherry barbs in there, they're slow and docile. The tigers will rip them up eventually.

Hillstream loaches tend to like lots of current and oxygen I believe, so a heads up with them too.

[dpatte]

I have kept cherries with tigers without an issue.

[Nerine]

I have a moss ball and it 'dances' about with an upside down internal filter!!! so that it pushes the moss ball about...lots of agitation at the bottom of my tank!!

[masoud100]

With my stocking how would Zebra Thorn Snails do? I read about them and found out they dont breed (YAAAAAAA! for me). Would Tiger Barbs or Red Tail Black Shark eat them? I am thinking of getting rid of my Hillstream Loach and my Bala Sharks so my tank would for now have Tiger Barbs, and Red Tail Black Shark. I am thinking of adding 6 Zebra Thorn Snails as my cleanup crew to clean my glass

[blueknight0303]

as far as i can tell you dont have any fish on your list thats going to kill them.

[Fishnut]

You'll still have to scrub the glass with the snails in there.  They eat algae but not always all of it.

[blueknight0303]

to add up, if you want effective algae eaters, get nerite/zebra snails.. they do breed and lay eggs but eggs wont hatch on freshwater. also eggs are a pain to remove on glass if you dont like stuff sticking on your glass.

[masoud100]

Ya the Zebra Thorn Snails arwe the same thing as Zebra Nerile. So your saying they will still lay eggs will it look obvious, and wouldnt my fish eat the eggs?

[blueknight0303]

zebra snails are probably 5x larger than zebra thorn snails. yes and no... the eggs are like white spots that will stick on anything and fish wont even try to eat them. try doing a s research about them.

[masoud100]

Well I got my Zebra Thorn Snails before I saw your post and now got to live with them. They look good though but are pretty small and I have 6 of them. I could return them and get 4 zebra snails (bigger size) instead. What should I do? I dont want to get extra snails and I know zebra thorn are infertile in freshwater does the same hold true with zebra snails?

Also now my stocking is 10 Tiger Barb, 10 Green Tiger Barb, 1 Red Tail Black Shark, 1 Golden Algae Eater, 6 Zebra Thorn Snail (will trade them for 4 Zebra Snails), and 1 HillStream Loach (also may sell). I cant find any siamease algae eaters anywhere and will continue to look for them.

I found an amazing fish yesterday called Leopard Ctenopoma. I am interested in getting it. Need some experience forum members input because sotre employees dont know anything i.e.) zebra thorn snails will get as big as zebra snails, apistomgramma is good with tiger barbs, etc. "I have done research on the Leopard Ctenopoma and found they are from Africa and are kind of predatory fish but will not eat anything that is fairly its size. It will eat tropical flakes, bloodworms, etc and even feeder fish once its big enough (max size 6 inch)

[Fishnut]

Well I got my Zebra Thorn Snails before I saw your post and now got to live with them. They look good though but are pretty small and I have 6 of them. I could return them and get 4 zebra snails (bigger size) instead. What should I do? I dont want to get extra snails and I know zebra thorn are infertile in freshwater does the same hold true with zebra snails?

This is why I keep recommending you read more before buying.  There is never ever going to be a time when you absolutely MUST buy a creature for your tank.  Patience is the key in this hobby.  There should be absolutely no reason that you should regret purchasing a creature after the fact, if you do thorough research.

The Leopard Ctenopoma is a very fascinating fish.  Carnivore though and it's mouth opens up almost as wide as it's body.  If the info you found says it eats feeder fish, what do you think will become of your tiger barbs and hillstream loach and algae eater when the Leopard Ctenopoma quickly attains it's adult size?  Don't stop researching after you find a little bit of info.  Keep digging.

[Nerine]

2nd that - it will eat your fish. But if you're ok with that, then go ahead and get it!

also - it MAY eat snails too? - it says it will eat anything that fits in it's mouth...and trust me when they say that, it means they will TRY to put everything in their mouths! My Zamora's snack on EVERYTHING except the fish that are bigger than it...They have even consumed young convict cichlids...soooo if a small catfish can eat those, think of what would happen to your barbs!!

Just remember if you want to breed something, you should have it in a species only tank - including snails. fish love eating eggs...fish love picking at things...stick your hand in there for awhile, they will pull at the hairs on your arms! Sooo snail eggs = tasty treats!

In my 55 - I had 15 tiger barbs, 1 red tail black shark, 1 blue gourami (because it was a left over from another tank) 1 large pl*co, and a few Zamora woodcats, and that was it!

[masoud100]

I have read about the Leopard Ctenopoma and have come to a conclusion that is should be fine with my tiger barbs especailly at this moment. The only real food that the ctenopoma may eat is the snails, but snails really are not that much of an issue for me if they do die in the future as it is nature. But the Zebra Thorn Snails may have the thorn for defense and therefore make the Ctenopoma fail its mission. I have seen a couple vids as well with Ctenopoma mixed with Tiger Barbs and RTBS and got along since they were big enough. The Ctenopoma is known to eat 1/3 of its size. So at max size it should be able to consume 2 inches. All my fish except for a few tiger barbs are all 2 inches are bigger and the Ctenopoma I will get will be about 3 inches so I should be good. Here is a pic of my tank right now any suggestions are good

[Nerine]

It says they need a lot of areas to hide.

I wouldn't get it for awhile yet...you just added lots of stuff, let the tank settle in.

[masoud100]

Ya I was not thinking of getting it for a while maybe another 1-2 weeks minimum. I will be getting more plants to fill out my tank and also since my light might be too strong 108watts T5H0 in a 50 gallon tank I was thinking of buying something called Bamboo ...(at PEtsmart) its a fake plant but it says you can leave it in as a floating plant and therefore would it decrease the amount of light pressure my plants recieve?

[Fishnut]

Interesting how sound advice is ignored yet bad advice is welcomed because the bad advice supports what you want to do.

As a member of OVAS, I believe this type of fish keeping practice is not something we should be involving ourselves with any more.  No matter how many times someone tries to correct the problems you create for yourself, you do what you want at the expense of your aquatic pets.  OVAS stands for preserving aquatic life and for educating people to become better aquarists, not for supporting people who do whatever they want regardless.

I'm finished with this frustrating, "I want what I want at whatever cost" thread. 

[Brine]

I have read about the Leopard Ctenopoma and have come to a conclusion that is should be fine with my tiger barbs

how did you come to that conclusion?

[masoud100]

@Fishnut I am sorry if I have made you furious and now looking at it I am acting like I want to only accept opinions of what I want. So Fishnut in your opinion I should not have a Ctopoma? Then please give me a stocking list and think of it as your own tank

Currently I have :
10 Tiger Barbs
10 Green Tiger Barbs
1 Red Tail Black Shark
1 Hillstream Loach
1 Golden Algae Eater
7 Zebra Thorn Snails

What should I do @Fishnut because I will only listen to your stocking advise give me a list of other fish I should keep with my current fish.

And I came to that conclusion of Tiger Barb and Ctopoma mixing well is because Tiger Barbs are shaped diferently thus harder to swallow, they are faster and also can hold their own not to mention they are atleast 2 inches and will grow to about 3.5

[Brine]

I don't know anything about them but the first three pages I googled said the same thing....aggressive and carnivorous...they will eat anything that fits in their mouth...it didn't say anything about shape of the fish or speed, just that they will eat it if they can. I would expect them to eat Barbs. That being said there are sometimes exceptions to the rules. I wouldn't put one in with Barbs

[masoud100]

So to my stocking list what would you add? Think of it as your own tank I want something that looks good, maybe a 1 centre piece option, etc

[Nerine]

the red tail black shark should be your centerpiece!