OC Transpo Driver Fired

[elk]

Have you seen the video on Youtube of the driver swearing and threatening the passenger?

What are your thoughts and opinions?

[JetJumper]

Apparently this is the guy who was pestering the driver.

http://www.youtube.com/user/10thDimensionMatty

Interesting...

[JetJumper]

Just found this as well
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/story/2011/11/07/ottawa-octranspo-driver-tirade.html?cmp=rss

[Stussi613]

I love how the union says its inconclusive as to whether the driver was the one yelling or the passenger, yet you can clearly hear the shouter saying "when I open my door, you're going to get off".

I can just hear all the forthcoming comments (on the story, not on here) about whether you can shoot pictures and videos on OC buses already. It's actually illegal for OC to stop you from taking a picture, or video, on one of its buses...From OC' official By-Laws:

(6) No person shall operate any camera, video recording device, movie camera or any similar device on transit property without the express written permission of the Director.
(7) Subsection (6) does not apply to the following:
(a) the operation by a person of any camera, video recording device, movie camera or similar device on a transit vehicle where such operation is for personal use; or
(b) the operation by a person of any camera, video recording device, movie camera or similar device on a transit station platform area where such operation is for personal use

[bt]

Saw it on the (national) news last night.

My thoughts before seeing it were "Maybe the passenger deserved to have a strip torn off them, wouldn't be the first time".

After seeing it?

No excuse for that kind of behaviour.  I don't care what triggered it.  Even if the passenger did deserve a strip torn off them (something the video doesn't firmly establish either way, though the passenger does repeatedly attempt to apologize), this was not remotely an appropriate response.

And of course, the driver will likely get off completely, or with a slap on the wrist at worst because we don't see the start of the altercation.

[smalltownfan]

As the Superintendent of Transit Operations I would like to apologize to all members of this forum exposed to the behaviour of the driver in the video.  He gives a bad name to OC and is an embarrassment to the vast majority of hardworking and dedicated drivers who work for this company.

Hopefully people will realize this is an isolated incident and not paint all Operators with the same brush.

As there now is an investigation taking place, I can say no more.

Hank

[Cheebs]

For sure Hank, 99% of the drivers I've dealt with are hard working good people. Sometimes they might be haivng a bad day and be a bit grumpy which is acceptable, but this guy crosses the line, and that shouldn't reflect on all the other drivers. I do find it a bit silly that the response to this was basically citing that the accusations are invalid because of rules about video taping on buses... The person that taped it clearly only did so once it had all started, and was likely doing so because a rider's rights were being violated.

Having taken the bus very often, I've witnessed on several occasions mentally challenged riders chatting up the drivers. The drivers always showed a great deal of respect for them and politely chatted back. I'm not quite sure what set this particular driver off and I don't know the story, but it seems completely out of line. I'd like him to take responsiblity for it and not hide behind loopholes about video taping.

[smalltownfan]

I agree Phil,
   There are procedures for the Operator to follow. He may have had issues with this passenger but that is no excuse to react like he did in public.

[bt]

Yes - there's the rare bad operator who goes off on a passenger, but I agree the overwhelming majority are polite (or at least professional, which is all I ask for) in their dealings with riders.  I've encountered maybe 3 or 4 drivers with actual attitude problems (not counting cases of bad days) in about 10 years, and no outbursts remotely like this one.

Which is impressive, given the stupid stuff they have to put up with from some riders.  I've seen abuse directed at a driver far more often than I've seen it come from a driver.

[Stussi613]

Smalltown, it goes without saying that many people will not lump this driver in with the hundreds who perform their job diligently, with respect and a professional attitude...and the few that literally risk their lives to help people in accidents and burning houses. While your apology is appreciated, it's not necessary.

Chubs, I'm not sure if you were talking about general reaction to the video, or what I posted above. To clarify on my post I was illustrating that OC Transpo vehicles are considered public domain for the purposes of photography/videography and OC's by laws clearly state that anyone can engage in the act of capturing an image on an OC vehicle providing that they are not doing so for commercial gain.

[Cheebs]

Ah yes, sorry I was reffering to the public's and OC traspo's reaction... I completely agree with you

[elk]

Everyone is innocent until proven guilty.

In the video do we actually see the driver arguing and swearing at the passenger,
ABSOLUTELY NOT.

This video could very well be staged to try and extorte money from OC Transpo.

With all the current technology there should be security surveillance in all buses just like they have in police cars and taxis.

[Stussi613]

Everyone is innocent until proven guilty.

In the video do we actually see the driver arguing and swearing at the passenger,
ABSOLUTELY NOT.

This video could very well be staged to try and extorte money from OC Transpo.

With all the current technology there should be security surveillance in all buses just like they have in police cars and taxis.

He's so innocent that OC Transpo officials are apologizing in newspapers and even on this forum...

[Severum]

That driver should take some lessons from the singing bus driver that would be on the Kanata Expresses. Whats better than showtunes on your way home from work.

[bt]

In the video do we actually see the driver arguing and swearing at the passenger,
ABSOLUTELY NOT.

There were 3 people on the bus - the driver, the passenger being yelled at, and the guy with the camera.

It's been all-but-confirmed that it is the driver's voice, as well:

Mercier conceded the images in the video are "consistent" with the swearing and yelling voice belonging to the driver.

[Medym]

Just a couple things for you guys to maybe ponder;

The YouTube account this was posted to was created 2 Nov 2011.  The video was posted in the wee hours of 3 Nov 2011 after having occured at approx 0230hrs 3 Nov 2011.  Im sure this is just odd timing on the part of the guy with the cell video.

From another website, the guy who took the video posted:

I took that video, it was 2:30am on Thursday, November 3rd. After the Moody stop I took notice that it was only me, this other passenger, and the driver. I felt that my intervention would have only gotten me in trouble. The very next day I submitted my video to YouTube and put it up on Reddit, went down to the police station and tried to file a report. The police did not file a report but rather forwarded me to the OC Transpo Special Constable and we talked for a bit and he told me that this driver did not file any sort of complaint within OC Transpo. The driver stopped on the Queensway in an attempt to get this passenger off. Thank goodness that he stayed on. I felt I have done everything possible to make this public.

I have learned that this guy's name is Matty and he was practicing for a school play. He was rehearsing his lines and he was speaking rather loud. He seemed to make other passengers uncomfortable as they moved away from him on the bus. After the Moody stop I looked down towards the back of the bus and only saw Matty. At that time it was just Matty, the driver, and I. Matty approached the driver and he was being very obnoxious towards the driver. The driver told Matty to sit down and after about 5 minutes of not sitting down the driver detonated and started the rant you see in the video.

So after 5 minutes of this "mildly autistic" kid bothering the driver with who knows what language, the driver looses his cool.  Oddly enough after 5 minutes of watching this happen, the cell phone video only captures the driver yelling.  Where is the other 4 minutes where he watched the guy bother the driver?  I will say, the bus driver was inappropriate, however do not know what was said to trigger this reaction.

I took a couple minutes to google the kid.  Take a look on Youtube to see the videos this guy makes:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Matt+Taronno+&aq=f

He does a terrible and offensive Borat type skit on Parliament Hill on three occasions.  On the Youtube video posted by the media, there are comments from classmates saying things like "lol, that is totally Matt, by the way check out a video we made together at....."

Sure there are a bunch of things which could be a coincidence, but my guess is this kid baited the driver into a reaction and he got a good one.  Does that excuse the bus driver, no; but there is another side to this story in my opinion.

[Hookup]

Cool. I like big threads!

Sounds like one of those things we'll never truly know the whole story...

[elk]

well here we go again with another video on youtube.

Why are people out to ruin oc drivers reputation.

We all do it while driving,not so much holding phone in ear but texting still is an issue.

These drivers are up everyday at 4am and work long hours to get you to where you want to go.

I dont see any videos on youtube of people in cars on the phone.

[Stussi613]

Why are people out to ruin oc drivers reputation.

Why are you, obviously an OC driver based on your other posts in this thread, posting these questions on a fish forum? 

I don't think anyone is trying to ruin their reputation. A few of them are doing a pretty good job of ruining it for the majority on their own. 

[Cheebs]

No need for hard feelings... Elk, you brought up a question, people opined, and that's just how we feel . If people chose to label all drivers because a couple of them made mistakes, then that's their issue, but I think most people do realize these are isolated incidents.

[Greatwhite]

To be perfectly honest, the video doesn't show anything leading up to the lashing.  We are all just going on what this kid says happened.  For all I know, that Matt guy could have been harassing the bus driver to get a rise out of him.  Why else would the other guy have recorded it?

This kid does lame Youtube videos...  What better way to get publicity than to post a video of a transpo bus driver swearing at him?  Just sayin'...

[freshwaterfun]

Well thing is even in news report the parents told them that there son is mildly autistic that's the issue and the reason the bus driver was acting the way he was was because the autistic guy was repeating something he had learned that day it's kinda like a tick like Tourette syndrome it can't be helped or controlled the young man even told the bus driver he was autistic and couldn't help it. Tbh it's not the first time I've seen a oc transpo bus driver act that way I'm glad it was caught on camera for once

[Nerine]

Bus drivers go through a LOT of stuff every day. Not everyone has the ability to hang on to their tempers. And yes while they shouldn't be driving, maybe that driver had a really bad week at home/work etc. Everyone looses it on someone at some point. Instead of video taping it, why didnt someone step in and stop it right away if they are so concerned? I would have if I was there. Would you? Would you interfere? Especially knowing about the man who was stabbed to death for trying to help someone?

People would rather sit back, laugh at their videos and watch someone get hurt. So this video just shows that people do NOT care. Unless there is someone stepping in to stop it. I didnt watch the video as I will not support the creator of this youtube video. Did he do anything to stop the driver?

[tophoo]

It's true that not everyone can hang on to their tempers. I agree, but as a bus driver and working with the public, he should. If you were at a restaurant and a server lashed out at ya and started dropping f-bombs, would that be ok since the server was having a bad day, or would you complain to the manager?

just saying

[salvini55]

interestingly, Matt closed his YouTube account. Although I disagree with the manner the driver "handled" the situation, I find myself taking his side.

[Nerine]

should and do are two different things. I've seen doctors loose their cool, everyone does it from time to time. not excusing his behaviour, just saying it's wrong of the person to video it and do nothing and everyone has their bad days. maybe he's headed for stress leave and just had to wait? who knows the whole story!

[Stussi613]

I'm no bus driver, and nor am I a perfect angel, but the correct action would have been to pick up the phone on every bus and have one of the OC rent-a-cops waiting at the next stop instead of verbally abusing the guy.  Like it or not, bus drivers are in a public facing position and have a duty to comport themselves in a curteous and professional manner. Everyone has bad days, and we don't know what the young man was doing to provoke this...but the video taped reaction was over the top IMO.  He didn't need to use the level of profanity he did to tell him to cut it out and get off the bus at the next stop.

[freshwaterfun]

well the main factor here as i noticed many of you did not see the interview and news report the young man did not provoke the bus driver the young college student is autistic and his autism is much like Tourette syndrome. The best way to explain it to people that do not know about it is a "itch" that has to be scratched the brain sends signals saying that he has the itch only way to cure it and rid himself of the itch is by acting oddly some people will twitch others will stick there tongue out randomly some say random words for no reason they have no control of how to solve the itch only the brain does.

His itch was he learnt something at school and he was repeating it not too loudly but loud enough for the bus driver to hear its a mental disability but rather then being shunned by society and staying secluded the young man is choosing to actually get a education and expand his knowledge and get a career despite his disability.

I agree 100% someone should of did something and explained the disability to the bus driver to clean up his attitude rather than just recording the incident. During the interview the autistic young man even said that he got off the bus early and actually feared that the bus driver was going to chase him out of the bus and attack him and he even told the bus driver of his disability but by that time the bus driver was already off the handle so to speak with his attitude. This is why when the mayor saw the video he actually made a personal apology to the young man and said there will be a investigation as it made the mayor sick to see that from anyone.

End point we are who we are many of us have medical issues that are hard to explain i myself suffer from many medical problems and am on disability due to it. But in no way shape or form should people with disabilities of any sort be treated like this incident descrimination such as this

you see many young kids with down syndrome and other medical problems that have ticks in them like Tourette syndrome but obviously you would not accept a bus driver screaming at a young child like that same goes with this situation anyways i think ive rambled enough about the subject.

[FocusFin]

Why are people out to ruin oc drivers reputation.

We all do it while driving,not so much holding phone in ear but texting still is an issue

I dont see any videos on youtube of people in cars on the phone.

There's a fundamental difference between an individual texting while driving home from work and a driver texting while transporting 20 or 30 people.

How would you feel if instead of a city bus driver texting, it was your child's bus driver texting or instead of the driver yelling at a young adult he was instead yelling at your 10 year old for acting up.

When people are put into a position of trust or of protecting others they assume a greater responsibility and have to act accordingly.

[Stussi613]

There's a fundamental difference between an individual texting while driving home from work and a driver texting while transporting 20 or 30 people.

How would you feel if instead of a city bus driver texting, it was your child's bus driver texting or instead of the driver yelling at a young adult he was instead yelling at your 10 year old for acting up.

When people are put into a position of trust or of protecting others they assume a greater responsibility and have to act accordingly.

+1

[Severum]

More OC Transpo news.
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/life/Singing+driver+silenced+Transpo/5677689/story.html

The singing bus driver was told to stop singing while carrying passengers. You can't please everyone.

[elk]

Well I just heard the union fired the driver.

[bt]

Citizen and Global News are both reporting that as well

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/driver+caught+yelling+passenger+fired+Transpo/5709175/story.html

Doesn't mean it's final though.

(Alain Mercier) wrote that the firing is provisional — the union has the option to grieve the dismissal

[Stussi613]

"Councillor Diane Deans, who chairs the transit commission...also said she'll be proceeding with an effort to review a 2007 city bylaw that forbids recording anything on OC Transpo property without Mercier's written permission, unless the recording is for "personal use." Queale has said that bylaw makes recordings like the damning one in this incident illegal."

Actually, that exact bylaw makes the recording of this incident perfectly legal. Only commercial recording, such as filming a movie or a music video, is illegal on city buses without Mercier's written permission. Nice to know Ms. Deans doesnt even understand the bylaw she wants reviewed, based on the unions incorrect interpretation of the bylaw. 

[Cheebs]

Poor guy, he lost a parent and another family member to cancer in the past year (or something along those lines), and was spat on 2 days prior by another passenger. Misconduct or not, I feel sorry for him.

Yesterday my girlfriend was riding the bus and a handful of highscool kids were staying near the front and making fun of the passengers getting on to their faces. I bet the bus driver was quite afraid to say something because of all this crap going on. I would have punched them in the head myself. My point is I hope that because of this bus drivers don't allow passengers to step all over them even more.

[Stussi613]

Poor guy, he lost a parent and another family member to cancer in the past year (or something along those lines), and was spat on 2 days prior by another passenger. Misconduct or not, I feel sorry for him.

My friend, who is a bus driver, mentioned this to me as well. I think he was spat on the day before, actually, but chose not to take the day off with pay that he would normally have been offered in that situation. I also feel some compassion for him, but not much. I've had bad days too, but I've never  yelled at a customer because of it.

[smalltownfan]

I think he was spat on the day before,

A sign of the new times. I was a bus operator for 22 years, 1977 - 1999, before I went over to the "Dark Side" as my friends like to say. We never encountered incidents like this. A cultural thing for many "new Canadians" is to show displeasure by spitting at the person they are unhappy with. Unfortunately, we now have almost daily occurrences of this disgusting display.
How would you like a big gob in your face? Drivers are concerned about AIDS, HEP C and all of those wonderful other diseases spread by contact with saliva..

Areas where this occurs the most; South Keys, Montreal Road (Vanier), Rideau Centre, Richmond Road and Carling Avenue west of Pinecrest, Somerset west of Lyon and Walkley Road in the Albion area. I know, I read the reports.  But unfortunately the media doesn't (or won't) pick up on this.

I'm glad I'm not driving anymore, I'd probably lay a piece of shaved maple billy across their mouth and get charged for protecting myself.
I did carry one for when I worked nights in some of the ugly parts of town. I got "Chester" from my mother-in-law, the wife of a bus driver 1946-1970. Neither he or I had to ever use it. Nowadays it would be an almost daily thing.

My invitation still stands. If you want to see what my Controllers and their Operators deal with, PM me and I'll invite you to sit in and observe in the TOCC.

Hank

[bt]

And no surprise.... The union is going to argue the dismissal.

http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20111115/OTT-bus-union-fighting-firing-111115/20111115/?hub=OttawaHome

To be fair, it is part of the union's job to stand up for their members and try and get the best result for them.

From the sounds of it, they're going to push for a lighter punishment rather than complete forgiveness or to get the driver off completely on some minor technicality.

[Stussi613]

A sign of the new times. I was a bus operator for 22 years, 1977 - 1999, before I went over to the "Dark Side" as my friends like to say. We never encountered incidents like this. A cultural thing for many "new Canadians" is to show displeasure by spitting at the person they are unhappy with. Unfortunately, we now have almost daily occurrences of this disgusting display.
How would you like a big gob in your face? Drivers are concerned about AIDS, HEP C and all of those wonderful other diseases spread by contact with saliva..

Areas where this occurs the most; South Keys, Montreal Road (Vanier), Rideau Centre, Richmond Road and Carling Avenue west of Pinecrest, Somerset west of Lyon and Walkley Road in the Albion area. I know, I read the reports.  But unfortunately the media doesn't (or won't) pick up on this.

I'm glad I'm not driving anymore, I'd probably lay a piece of shaved maple billy across their mouth and get charged for protecting myself.
I did carry one for when I worked nights in some of the ugly parts of town. I got "Chester" from my mother-in-law, the wife of a bus driver 1946-1970. Neither he or I had to ever use it. Nowadays it would be an almost daily thing.

My invitation still stands. If you want to see what my Controllers and their Operators deal with, PM me and I'll invite you to sit in and observe in the TOCC.

Hank

There is little doubt in my mind that today's bus drivers deal with things they have no business dealing with...especially being spit on.  I have a friend who has been a driver for a few years and I've heard the horror stories first hand.  I know I wouldn't be able to restrain myself. My previous post wasn't to say that the things that the driver in question faced weren't difficult for him to deal with, simply to say that even those things aren't justification for his reaction.  I feel bad that he experienced thoe losses in his personal life, and that he was essentially assaulted a few days before.  I also feel that he reacted to the situation, got caught and ultimately had to deal with the consequences.  If it was only the driver and the young man on the bus who knows what would have happened...and the public wouldn't have known about it.

Of course the union is going to fight for the membership. And if you had a bad year and treated a driver in the same manner he treated that young man and they had a video of it...they'd be fighting to get you fired.

[rockgarden]

I used to be a member of the Transit Committee a number of years ago so have had the joy of committee level discussion of some pretty interesting things. Some drivers on some routes at some times of the day have jobs that very few of us would want. Some other routes at other times of the day are pretty decent.  Every driver on every route at any time of the day can tell stories about passengers that they would rather not have met. I've even had the joy of spilling my blood all over the floor of a bus when the driver had to slam on his brakes to avoid a stupid car driver and in the process flung me and my head in the direction of the fare box.  Some passengers tried to help while others complained that they would be late for work and strongly suggested to the driver that he just help me off the bus, report the incident to the call centre and leave me there to wait for medical help.  No joking!

My opinion on the recent YouTube incident.

Definitely the driver lost it (control).
Yes, alternate means of dealing with issue were likely available (central call center being the most obvious).
Extenuating circumstances - probably.
Firing: probably a bit harsh depending on prior record, etc., etc.,
Union response/obligation: Can't very easily condone the behaviour without losing credibility but can/must represent the member in discussion of the punishment.

I can remember once having a committee member discussion (likely coffee break chat during a break in the late night committee meeting) about adding video feed to central call center.  At the time, it was felt that drivers/union wouldn't support (management spying) and public wouldn't support (invasion of privacy) and cost would be an issue. Fast forward a decade or so and likely a lot easier to implement with newer technology but I suspect the objections would be the same despite the possible increase in confrontational behaviours on both sides being reporting in the media in recent years.

Re drivers talking on their phones and texting, etc.  Just got my car back from repair shop. Bumper replaced. My son was rear ended at slow speed by someone with something else on their mind! (I'm being kind!) In the same week, I had to swerve a couple of times at high speed on the Queensway in traffic to avoid being hit by drivers with cell phones held to their ears. You can probably guess how I feel about cell phones and drivers who use them while driving. On that issue, believe me, I feel the same about bus drivers, car drivers and taxi drivers. However, I don't remember the issue being raised when "Breaker 1-9" was a more common distraction. I was a lot younger then .

[elk]

Today in the media an OC TRANSPO driver was credited for saving a young girls life as she was beaten severely.
The incident took place on Oct 4.
A driver does something good and it takes 3 months to tell the public but when they are in the wrong its on all over the media same day.

[Hookup]

Today in the media an OC TRANSPO driver was credited for saving a young girls life as she was beaten severely.
The incident took place on Oct 4.
A driver does something good and it takes 3 months to tell the public but when they are in the wrong its on all over the media same day.

No idea, but might have something to do with the age of the child and protective services?

It's good to hear something positive.

[werehatwere]

I have to disagree with any comments saying that the driver should be sued. The national did a follow up report on the story witch they did not air. It talked about how this driver had a superb record of kindliness to passengers. This was a one time thing and the article talked about how in the 6 months leading up to this incident, not only had his wife died of cancer, but his daughter had fallen ill, and the day before all of this had happened, he was spat in the face, by a boy on his oc bus, and he was also ripped off by numerous teens who had scammed his with their bus tickets. He was bound to snap some time as we are only human. And anybody on this fourm who says that "It is not acceptable to react like that" I can guarantee that you would react the same way.  No he should not be fired, or sued, or given a bad name for something any human being would do.

[NanoSF]

Really, a show that didn't air? Then where did you get the info. Post a link or something, because this sounds like gossip.

Not that it really matters. I am a teacher and if a kid spits on me after my wife dies, I still get fired if I threaten physical violence on a kid while berating him with insults and profanity. I have also heard from a couple of other drivers I know that this is not his first offence. He has had a few inappropriate actions in his past record. Maybe they didn't run the story because the information was from suspect sources. My sources are suspect too, but I don't necessarily believe either side. I just don't think it matters. I am sad for the guy. To loose your job if that is his situation is cruel, and would be terrible. It is just the way it is when you work with the public. You have to keep it in check no matter what the situation.

You think any human would do that, then you haven't been around many teachers or bus drivers, or many other professions. The amount of abuse they take and still maintain composure. This is not an uncommon situation the driver had to deal with. Peoples lives are hard, and driving a bus has it's issues. Many (basically all minus a small few) drivers deal with all of this abuse and maintain professionalism.

[walkytalky]

I agree with all of you.
  But at the same time. He made this choice of career. He should know that its not all peaches and cream. And that kids can be really nasty and right down cruel. If he felt that stressed out maybe he should have thought to take time off and destress. I realize we can't always  be in a good mood and sometimes it just takes one word to make us flip out. But hey don't take it out on the world, take it up with who it truly matters to.

[Greatwhite]

Unfortunately, no matter how bad we can feel for the bus driver (and I'm sure his bosses felt for him) the story went public, and the public perception of the whole thing was skewed toward the kid because it was the kid who went public. 

Any time anything like this happens, the company in question HAS to do something with high visibility to appease the public and firing the bus driver was the best/only thing that they could do...