60G - Planted

[sdivell]

Ok guys,
I had a BBA breakout before I moved my tank last week of september so when I moved I took out all the plants with BBA on the leaves and replanted.  Went from medium/heavily planted to very lightly planted.

And now the BBA is back and taking over again... So i've decided i have to break down the tank...might as well since I want to change my gravel substrate to flourite.

I'm going to tear it down saturday afternoon and put my fish in a tupper container that holds about 10g and keep my filter media wet in another bucket of tank water.

Next, I'm going to take out my rocks and drift wood and clean and scrub them under freshwater to try and get any BBA that might be on that off (any tips for this??..should i try baking them too? at what temp would i bake wood anyway?...never made a log loaf lol )

After the tank is empty I'm going to clean the whole inside of the tank and then put in my rinced flourite.  put my driftwood and rocks back in the tank and refill with fresh water and replace my fish. 

I'm going to wait until I get my bubble ladder (on special order @ BA's) and get Co2 into the tank before I go buy new plants.

Does anybody see a flaw in my plan?... should this wipe out the BBA for good?

[Zoe]

Do you have fluorite already?  I'm taking down one of my tanks and you can have the fluorite if you want it... used for a few months, normal brownish color, enough for your tank.

You don't need to bake your rocks, but boiling them might help get the green out. You can also soak them in a 1:20 bleach:water solution for a couple hours, and rinse many times with heavily dechlorinated water.

If you already have new fluorite, don't rinse it.  First of all, you'll NEVER get it to rinse clean and you'll be rinsing away all the good ferts. Second, I've used fluorite in two tanks, and when I did NOT bother rinsing it but just put it in dry, it was way less cloudy when I filled it up with water.  I don't know why, but wet fluorite clouds more.

That should wipe out your BBA but won't prevent it from coming back in the event that your tank becomes unbalanced again.  The CO2 should do a fair job of taking care of that, though.

[fischkopp]

Next, I'm going to take out my rocks and drift wood and clean and scrub them under freshwater to try and get any BBA that might be on that off (any tips for this??..should i try baking them too? at what temp would i bake wood anyway?...never made a log loaf lol )
...
I'm going to wait until I get my bubble ladder (on special order @ BA's) and get Co2 into the tank before I go buy new plants.

Does anybody see a flaw in my plan?... should this wipe out the BBA for good?

You should definitely boil/bake your wood and rocks. I used H2O2 last time: I took the rock out, and poured some over the affected part (well, which was all of the surface) and let it sit and bubble until the reaction was over, rinsed it and put it back into the tank. A day later BBA became a nice red color and now after one/two weeks my ottos have cleaned all the dead parts and the rock is almost new You should still go with baking/boiling as it is easier i guess, but the H2O2 method is quite useful to clean the equipment (filter, heater ....)

As for preventing BBA to come back: I found the only way to keep it controlled is CO2. But you will have to keep an eye on the ferts too. Just adding CO2 will not help, you have to balance light/CO2/ferts for your tank so that they plants just have all they need. There are some nice threads about BBA in the planted section ....

Good plan in general. Should work out fine.

[sdivell]

yes I'm deffinetly going to keep my Co2 in my tank now..well soon as I get the bubble ladder anyway.

excuse my ignorance but what is H202?...(edit: NEVERMIND i googled it!)

does flourite ever lose its ferts and just become gravel again?

[Zoe]

Hydrogen Peroxide... works great for getting algae off stuff!

[BigDaddy]

does flourite ever lose its ferts and just become gravel again?

Short answer, no.

[Zoe]

I don't think so... the gravel pellets are made up of what makes fluorite good, and not just coated in it. 

[sdivell]

Good enough!
ok a tougher question to add to this!
I've been thinking about upgrading my lighting for this tank since its all a stock kit that i got from superpet liquidation... it only has a 30watt canopy on it.

I want to upgrade the lighting to get it over 2 wpg (right now its 1.4wpg)...whats the best way to upgrade this?..the tank does NOT have a plastic rim around the top its bare glass.
i was thinking of adding a glass lid with a t-5 strip lights...but do i need a plastic rim for this?

[Zoe]

If you go with T5s, then yeah, you need a piece of glass to protect the bulbs from splashes.
I'm a fan of coralife powercompacts... they have a little piece of glass built in that protects the bulbs, and you can get legs to have the fixture rest on the rim. petsandponds.com has them for a good price.

[dan2x38]

Like Zoe said don't rinse your flourite... place a suacer on top of the substrate then pour water over that... I did the break down thing mine was cleared up the next day... I kept & used close to 50% of my old water... after a few days did a 25% WC... I also rinsed my sponge filter in tank water a few days later because of all the dust, plant shedding, etc. it was almost clogged floating pushing up the cover on my AC... if you add more light especially PCs you will have to have a very stable source of CO2 or the BBA will really take off...

[charlie]

Ok guys,
I had a BBA breakout before I moved my tank last week of september so when I moved I took out all the plants with BBA on the leaves and replanted.  Went from medium/heavily planted to very lightly planted.

And now the BBA is back and taking over again... So i've decided i have to break down the tank...might as well since I want to change my gravel substrate to flourite.

I'm going to tear it down saturday afternoon and put my fish in a tupper container that holds about 10g and keep my filter media wet in another bucket of tank water.

Next, I'm going to take out my rocks and drift wood and clean and scrub them under freshwater to try and get any BBA that might be on that off (any tips for this??..should i try baking them too? at what temp would i bake wood anyway?...never made a log loaf lol )

After the tank is empty I'm going to clean the whole inside of the tank and then put in my rinced flourite.  put my driftwood and rocks back in the tank and refill with fresh water and replace my fish. 

I'm going to wait until I get my bubble ladder (on special order @ BA's) and get Co2 into the tank before I go buy new plants.

Does anybody see a flaw in my plan?... should this wipe out the BBA for good?

In the past , i have done the bleach dip @ 10 - 1 ratio on rocks & drift wood for 15-30 mins with good success, followed by lots of rinsing & overnight soak with a good dechlorinater & another rinse.

I would keep as much of the water if not all to refill the tank , only because it would be easier on the fish rather than completely new water.

 BBA will always be a problem when your tank is out of balance ( ferts & co2), there is lots posted on this subject in the plant forum.

Flourite is stable clay substrate , which is very rich in iron , followed by magnesium & potassium & several other minerals, unfortunately plants that take most of their nutrients from the water column do not benefit as much from the flourite ( subject to debate ).

I would suggest for lighting a single 24 watt T5 fixture as a upgrade to what you have @ present, i could be wrong , but i believe this will give you a lot more useable light in your tank. I know that your 2 xT8 is already giving you 1.4 WPG, but the T5 fixture ( 1.2 wpg) is superior to your ex sisting lighting, this will keep you from crossing the threshold & going to a high light.

I was going to make a glass top for my hagen 21 gln @ one time, was going to have the glass cut 1/4 inch longer than the width of the tank  & also have it 1/8 longer than the depth of the tank, then glue a 1/8 strip of acrylic  around the outside , so the top can`t slide,  you would probably have to make it a fraction longer & deeper than 1/4 & 1/8 for clearance.
my 2 cents
Regards

[dan2x38]

As for making a glass top you can order a plastic hinge & handle from here: http://www.mops.ca/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/skus/hd/HDPR-R01052.asp?L+scstore+nymv0413ffa950a9+1192051776 This is a Canadian company in BC.

[sdivell]

Well Saturday I worked my little but off and got the tank empty, and cleaned it out.  Took the rocks and boiled them.  Took the drift wood out and washed it under hot water for 5 mins.

I put the florite in the tank and filled it up with freshwater.  WOW cloudy! so I let it run for 12 hours with the filter going to clear it up and cycle the new water through the established filter a few times before putting my fish back in their home.

Everybody is home now and I have some new hygros and swords planted in the flourite... can't wait to see everything set hold and take off.   Co2 ladder should be in tomorrow so I'll be able to get Co2 into the tank tomorrow night.

Here is a picture how it looked before i moved (no close ups so you cant see the algae problem.)


ANnnnnnd here is a photo from tonight!

[fischkopp]

I like the more dramatic arrangement of wood and rocks.

But I wonder where all the plants are Did they really look that bad that you have to throw them all out? Usually it helps already to remove the old/worst leaves. Seriously, you should add a lot more (fast growing) plants soon that you have something in your tank that can compete with algae.

I dont want to scare you here, just a little warning    I am sure this new setup will beat the old one in a couple of weeks. 

[sdivell]

Thanks, I like the new wood and rock work a lot too.

And yes I really did have bad algae.  That photo was taken before it got bad and i started prunning leaves but it seemed like everyday i would be pully more leaves off my hygros until i was left with just stems in the tank... and when new leaves grew in I'd have more algae on them too.  The algae really had taken over.

So after a lot of reading and conversations with other forum members I think the combo of me over doing it with ferts and under doing it with Co2 was the reason for the outbreak.  Hopefully this time around I can keep the water params more consistant and have a nicer looking tank.

[Glouglou]

For the lighting I will go with the new Hagen T5 HO retrofit with individual reflector (Include)
I saw them in my friend petshop and I was really impress with it.

[fischkopp]

new Hagen T5 HO retrofit with individual reflector

Yes, I must say that too (even if you havent asked ): these are great lights. I have some of them and are totally happy with it!

[sdivell]

is this a retrofit for my plastic canopy?... because I can't have glass lids (easily) with my tank.

Link??

[fischkopp]

is this a retrofit for my plastic canopy?... because I can't have glass lids (easily) with my tank.

Link??

http://www.hagen.com/canada/english/aquatic/glo/index.cfm

Its not a canopy. It sits on the sides, you can hang it or you can even get the system parts and build your own one.

I did run them without lid for a while. Worked totally fine (see here), the only reason why I put the lid back on was evaporation and that the shrimp always went for a walk ... 

[charlie]

Any updated pics ?

[sdivell]

I'll post some new pics tonight if i have a chance Charlie but I'm sad to report the bba is back and all over a couple of my slower growing hygros.  I'm currently concidering breaking down this tank in the new year and moving my salt water into it.. or selling it completly and going even bigger with salt... we shall see.

[sdivell]

Well its been....awhile since I've posted in this thread. (I know that because the forum is warning me that its been over 30 days since its been posted in and asking if I'm sure i want to post  )

My battle with bba maybe on its way down.  I have stopped running DIY Co2 yeast on this tank and begun overdosing with Flourish excel and after only 2 days the bba is turning red and dieing off.  The cycle of overdosing is 10 days before a large water change so I will keep an eye on that and update for anyone else who is battling evil bba. 

Also to report I've purchased a 60g tank - 48x12x24 and I will be slowly building that tank up to transfer this 21g into.  Go big or go home i guess  .

Now onto a new topic for this thread the new 60g I'm going to be building a DIY stand and a DIY light hood.  After conversations with Charlie and Big Daddy (i wish he would change his name, i get uncomfortable saying it) I think I'm going to go with T5's from B&B Hydroponics - discussed here http://ovas.ca/index.php?topic=22065.0 -  My plan is to purchase 3 of the 54watt 48" t5s and building my own reflectors for them.  Anyone know if I'm going to have trouble fitting them in with only 12" width to work with?

Also anyone want to help design the hood so I can have a nice wood look and still be able to get good access for maintenance?

[sdivell]

BBA is gone... Excel worked like a charm with no plant loss.  So anyone fighting this BBA sickness I would recommend 1 cap full per 20 gallons per day for 10 days followed by a big water change.  the bba all turned red then disappeared. 



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[sdivell]

Ok, things are well on their way now.  lets get up to speed.

Equip:
60g tank purchased - 48x12x24
Metal stand purchased - needed some TLC to get it nicely level and sturdy but a good deal
AC110 purchased at petsmart on sale - I may also try and get a used canister filter to run as well but for now the HOB will be fine as I don't plan to overstock this one.
Coralife 2x65watt pc fixture on sale at BAs

Plans: Ok this is where I am lacking 
The height is an issue as the stand is pretty high plus having a 24" tank ontop of it, I might actually construct a small step infront of the tank to make maintenence and planting a little easier.

Aquascaping I was hoping for a very 'canada lake' look with a good hunk of driftwood (probably the same one i have in my 21g) and some good sized rocks. 

I was hoping to go with only flourite as a substrate but that being said I was thinking about building up one side of the tank with a slate wall and a deep substrate to give some depth.  (Could I use brown gravel under this section without trouble?)

I have 2 bags of flourite in my 21 which i plan on moving into the 60 I'm also going to buy 3 new bags giving me a total of 75lbs (is that over kill?)

any ideas on types of rocks i should use? sources for this rock?
Stocking ideas? 

[sdivell]

Long day but its up and full of water.  Planted some spiral val that I got from Bigdaddy and were growing out in my 21g.

still really cloudy as I have 2 new bags of flourite in there under 2 old bags of flourite.  I've got probably 5" of flourite though which should be a nice base for planting. 

My plan is to do an amazon river tank so I'm going to do mostly tetras and corys and maybe a couple blue rams when the tank gets cycled.

What do you guys think?

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[Toss]

Looks clean for 4 bags of fluorite
5", don't you think is a bit too much? You will have some concern when you do gravel vac, but if you go with swords, it is perfect

[sdivell]

Doing tank maint. today so I thought I would snap a shot of the tank to show the progress.  Most of the plants have finally set roots...except for the dwarf sag in the front (only about 3 plants) they keep up rooting which is a pain to replant with my 24" tall tank.. i basically go swimming.

I need some taller plants and I may head out to BA today to check out if they have any angels.



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[Laura]

I have a 24" tall tank too, and find it not without its challenges.   Aquascaping can be quite difficult, especially at the back of the tank.

I have more watts per gallon than you, but my tank also doesn't have CO2. Most of my stem plants are quite leggy for the first 6" from the bottom and then start getting enough light to grow nicely.
I don't know if you're looking for suggestions on plant species, but the ones that do well in my tank are:
- crypts (I've got wendtii and something else short and green), balansae is a nice tall contrast,
- if you can get your hands on one of the plant contest plants, it's amazing; very attractive and tall.
- Crinum calamistratum.  Again, a tall thin plant.
- I have java fern (both types) tied to driftwood for plants at different heights.
- pennywort does very well in my tank, and I also good growth at the bottom of the tank.
- African fern tied to low driftwood makes for some good mid level plant growth
- Hygro's a good option to try too.
- If my fish didn't devour moss, then I'd have that tied on too.

I don't know if you make it out to the auctions, but many sp of these show up there.

[sdivell]

Haven't updated this since Feb.

The tank has obviously grown in a little more and some new plants have been added and some plants have been subtracted.

I've upgraded the filter to a Rena XP2.. and you might notice in the picture that I'm also still running my AC110.  I'm going to leave it on for a few weeks while the media in the Rena seeds.



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[DawnMarie81]

   Your tank looks great, I really like the amount of plants you got in there, not over done and not under done.  I need to add more to my tank, but have to get the algae thing under control first I think....

[sdivell]

Thanks Dawn.

I'm actually still trying to get more plants to fill this tank in a little more.  My goal is to not have any substrate or background visible when you look into the tank.  Still a lot more plants to be aquired yet.