What does OVAS and the Forum do especially for Kids .....

[Saltcreep]

except for things like the picnic or BBQ or Christmas Party, of course.

I'm currently building a complete system including a custom stand for a young friend of mine just getting into the hobby, and I have been wondering where will she go for the answers to the inevitable questions she'll have once we get everything set up. When we have questions, we go to OVAS, but what about the kids? In a PM conversation I had with Nerine a few months ago, she mentioned that at one time, OVAS had 70 young members. And, I'm guessing that at that time 'on-line' probably hadn't even entered the picture. How many youth are Club members or Forum members now? My bet is not too many. OVAS has a huge wealth of good information available but, is it attractive to kids? Could they be intimidated about things like 'where would I post this' or 'would they think my question is silly'?

So, with all the changes I see happening to the forum, could there be room for one more? How about a board specifically for kids? Maybe call it 'The Kid Zone' or 'For Kids Only' I see a special section where kids could post questions, amazing discoveries, or just 'WOW, look what I got'. One specific forum board where they wouldn't have to worry about the intricacies of is it salt, fresh, plants, Goldies, Mollies or equipment, because they would all be there in one board. Think of little Sarah, at home with a sick Goldfish and a babysitter who is of no help. Maybe someone on the board might suggest a water change or a bubbler. One of the goals of OVAS is to educate, and where better to begin than with young people, before they learn all the bad habits? A section where questions from the younger members could be answered by their peers (with a moderator keeping close tabs), not some adult saying 'you should know better'. In fact, I'm positive, there are twelve year olds, or younger, within reach of OVAS who know way more about this hobby than I do and I've been doing it for almost thirty-five years. I'll bet there are many young people that would jump at this, having already been introduced to the hobby by Mom or Dad, who themselves might be OVAS Club or forum members.

I know, I know, this would take an incredible amount of work. It would need a very special kind of moderator; one with the patience of a saint, and a genuine desire to help kids learn. The mod would have to access the board frequently, making sure that things were going smoothly and stepping in occasionally to answer a difficult question or put something right.

The reason I'm putting this out there is because just a few minutes ago I sent the young lady a few pictures of the progress on the tank and I thought about including a link to OVAS where she could do some research on her new pets. I didn't because I really had no idea where to direct her once she got to the forum. I didn't see it as being very kid friendly.

I realize this would be a HUGE undertaking, especially for the moderator, but I thought it would be worthwhile to just 'run it up the flagpole'.

Thanks for reading if you got this far.

Thoughts ..... opinions?

[dan2x38]

Saltcreep your right about the youth not having a draw here. My son use to be a acitive member when he was 8 & 9 but then lost interest. He stopped attending meetings and going online. No one chatted with him and he felt left out so we stopped renewing his membership. OVAS sells a family membership and it is great deal but there is little for the younger hobbyist to do.

I believe it would be a great idea to invlove the kids more but I also believe first OVAS needs to get the projects moving forward before taking new projects. Hard to keep to many balls in the air.

Halloween & Christmas are great times to get kids/families involved like a group rate for huanted hay ride, winter sliegh ride, stuff like dat dare... But all in all be tricky I bet to get hobbyists without kids to attend meetings focused on kids when they have none? I like the idea but hard to get going I think.

[Brent Shaver]

One option that could help in this matter and also help members that just cant make it to meetings.

I was thinking and I am no where suggesting myself as I dont have the experience in many areas to pull it off, but the site has offered Flash Chat since I have been a member and for the most part has sat dormate.

What about a scheduled time for a kid friendly chat that a member could host to offer simple topics that last a hour or how ever long there is interest.

This could actually work well for adults as well.  Not to mention it might be easier to get a guest speaker to log in from thier home instead of making the long trip to Ottawa to host a meeting.  Which would reduce costs to the club and increase availibity of guest speakers that cant make the trip.

This is just a suggestion which I think could really help giving information to the people that just cant make the meeting or for kids that love fish but dont have the support of thier parents to get to the meetings.

[Nerine]

One of my pet projects is working on coming up with things to get children involved again...Tossing around the ideas of hosting talks at schools, with one of the exec (I miss doing school talks!)

But the thing is...we used to have a LOT of children in this club at one time...I think it was over 90 children...that were MEMBERS...but this was back before the days of serious computer gaming and over loading of school activities/sports. Now children are stretched so thin, that having one more activity doesn't always work.

But...I am working on some ideas to bring to the exec to help with getting children involved and welcome any suggestions!

I have TRIED Halloween parties. But nobody dresses up or participates... for the past couple years I have dressed up, brought cookies I've made and decorated, and let's see...how many children have shown up? ONE. (btw - I will be asking you dress up and participate in October again as I will bring candy/cookies)

But there was a time there were children running all over the place a few years ago!! Halloween was fun too, we had pin the tail on the fish, we had prizes, games, costumes!
and even meetings...the children didn't always listen, they played in the background, but never seemed to bother people. just the occasional chuckle as they had fun sliding across the gym floor.

We don't need a meeting directed TO children...or if we do, it can be held during a time that better suited for the young people as mondays are a school night?

How many people here have children who are interested and who can attend a meeting geared for kids on a different day?
my son is 2 and has 3 tanks of his own, he feeds/waters and plays in lol.

If someone wants to help me in getting OVAS child friendly again, pm me and we'll brainstorm!

[Saltcreep]

One of my pet projects is working on coming up with things to get children involved again...Tossing around the ideas of hosting talks at schools, with one of the exec (I miss doing school talks!)

But the thing is...we used to have a LOT of children in this club at one time...I think it was over 90 children...that were MEMBERS...but this was back before the days of serious computer gaming and over loading of school activities/sports. Now children are stretched so thin, that having one more activity doesn't always work.

But...I am working on some ideas to bring to the exec to help with getting children involved and welcome any suggestions!

I have TRIED Halloween parties. But nobody dresses up or participates... for the past couple years I have dressed up, brought cookies I've made and decorated, and let's see...how many children have shown up? ONE. (btw - I will be asking you dress up and participate in October again as I will bring candy/cookies)

But there was a time there were children running all over the place a few years ago!! Halloween was fun too, we had pin the tail on the fish, we had prizes, games, costumes!
and even meetings...the children didn't always listen, they played in the background, but never seemed to bother people. just the occasional chuckle as they had fun sliding across the gym floor.

We don't need a meeting directed TO children...or if we do, it can be held during a time that better suited for the young people as mondays are a school night?

How many people here have children who are interested and who can attend a meeting geared for kids on a different day?
my son is 2 and has 3 tanks of his own, he feeds/waters and plays in lol.

If someone wants to help me in getting OVAS child friendly again, pm me and we'll brainstorm!

Well, all of that is pretty much the reason for my suggestion; no interest in or time for meetings, there's school and after school activities .. the list goes on. We know our kids are all over the internet anyway so this would give them a place to go online - just for them.

Heck, the idea was simple; the execution - maybe not so much.

[markw]

I realize time is vital to accommodate all types of members to meetings. The whole issue though is that if you make it interesting enough then kids will want to go, and they will prioritize things to accommodate it. Parents end up driving to soccer, hockey and all sorts of activities. Once a month isn't too much to ask to drag Mom and Dad along to a fish club too. It is a shame that the club has lost the younger sector. We all know that they still buy fish. Just go to any pet shop on a Saturday morning. Give them something tangible to see and participate in at a meeting and they'll appear. Times haven't changed that much I hope!

[Sue]

I remember that halloween night nerine mentioned it was fun for the kids.  I think that night kids were especially encouraged to come, so I wasn't worried my daughter would be too disruptive.
Mark is right something tangible at the meeting for them to feel part of helps. That bowl contest the exec have come up with is a great idea. If I read correctly its sort of a take home project, so hopefully some kids will get into that, or they could make a kids sub category where a pink gravel and plastic dinosaur theme fish bowl would have a chance.    Kids like to see live fish, so bowl shows were good for that.

For the website what if there was a coloring contest similar to what the local weatherman does... kids draw something with fish and it will get scanned and posted on some kind of bulletin board on the side bar of the website for a few days.

[holachicka]

For the website what if there was a coloring contest similar to what the local weatherman does... kids draw something with fish and it will get scanned and posted on some kind of bulletin board on the side bar of the website for a few days.

That is an AWESOME idea! I know my eldest daughter, a member of OVAS, would really enjoy something as creative as this as will my 8 yr old daughter, she is a craft freak Maybe something like from under 10 yrs, between 11-16 and then over 17 or something like that...The only thing is, I dont think it should be in on categories...as obviously the older ones will be more "experienced" then the younger ones but all in all, I LOVE THIS IDEA!!!

[Saltcreep]

That is an AWESOME idea! I know my eldest daughter, a member of OVAS, would really enjoy something as creative as this as will my 8 yr old daughter, she is a craft freak Maybe something like from under 10 yrs, between 11-16 and then over 17 or something like that...The only thing is, I dont think it should be in on categories...as obviously the older ones will be more "experienced" then the younger ones but all in all, I LOVE THIS IDEA!!!

Great start, keep 'em coming. This is more the kind of thing I was thinking about when I posted this; something to fill their time while they wait for a reply to their Tweet, or text, or whatever's coming next. The website is a great draw into OVAS for adults, and maybe it could be for kids too. If they find their experience in their own little corner of the site to be enjoyable, maybe they'll get on board as OVAS members like many adults do, and start going to meetings again.

[Vincenzo.]

i dont think we need a kids zone. they would be treated like young adults regardless. if a child wants to join, they should.. and not be shy to post in any of the forums. its a social community. i was in my 20`s when i first started salt, and was probably more nervous to ask questions than a 10yr old. i remember i was so scared the first time i saw amphipods and asked on a website, and felt totally silly afterwords.

[Saltcreep]

i remember i was so scared the first time i saw amphipods and asked on a website, and felt totally silly afterwords.

But, that's exactly my point. It would be a forum where kids could feel comfortable asking silly questions. They might even discover that lot's of other kids had the same silly question, so maybe it wasn't so silly after all. Like "Why is the water in my Goldfish bowl so green?".

[Vincenzo.]

So here is the Senario:
a 10yr old
a 30yr old
a 50yr old
and a 70yr old .... all start a fish tank on the same day.

each and everyone one of them have 0 experience on fish.

they will all be just as shy as the other, about asking `silly`questions.
.
.
.
does this mean we need to have sections on the forum each for them... like:

0-15 yr old forum.
16-25 yr old forum.
26-35 yr old forum.
36-55 yr old forum.
56+ yr old forum.

come on - a 30yr old will be just a shy about a silly question as a 10 yr old.

people just need to get over - no such thing as a silly question, even if its been asked 100 times, all ovas members are helpful people, and are always willing to help.

[Fishnut]

I'll admit that I haven't read every single word of every single post but perhaps there are some little things that the exec can do to encourage kids to participate in OVAS more.  It doesn't have to be on-line though.  The colouring contest was a cute idea.  As far as I can see, kids are still getting OUT and meeting people.  They tend to turn to computers for socializing when they get into their teens.  From my experience, it's uncommon for kids to initiate membership into a club like this.  I feel we need to attract the families if we're going to attract the kids.

The behavior and rash comments is the #1 thing that is making us unattractive to families.  I'm sure there are several members who have kids, the kids like fish  but the parents don't want the kids exposed to these emotional outbursts, the trashing, the flaming and the general concept that every idea that's posted is a great idea and everyone who disagrees with it is going to get it.  I've certainly noticed that there have been less and less kids attending meeting with their parents, which correlates to the increase in nastiness on-line.

Clean up the behavior and the families will return, along with the kids who are enjoying the hobby right along with their parents. I'm sure they'll find something interesting within the club.  Perhaps with an existing healthy kid population we'll start attracting kids who bring their families!

[Saltcreep]

You know, I would be thoroughly ticked (not the word I wanted) off if I were to see this thread, started with the intent that it was, locked by the mods because of a few posts. If there's one place I wouldn't expect to see this, it's in a thread about our kids. Really!!!

[sas]

Wow great discussion .

Please be nice .

[mseguin]

I don't think yuo can compare the numbers the club had in the 60's or whenever in terms of kids to today. I think that with school, sports, kids having more social lives these days, and parents being far more busy, you're not going to see those numbers. But the club can do more to attract kids for sure. I think the tank that OVAS set up in an elementary school was a step in the right direction.
As for seperate meetings or sections of the site, ask yourself this; as a kid, if you had a choice between sitting in a separate meeting with 5 or 10 other kids, or getting to sit in on the grownup meeting, which would you have preferred. Personally, I think offering or focussing more on the kids at our general meeting, and incorporating them into the website as a whole is the way to go. Kids want to be included, not set apart. But that's jsut my 2 cents.

[dan2x38]

My But he stopped because there was nothing for him at the meeting or online. They use to fun quizzes on a hand out they liked that. The meetings also go over time and he had school plus found it boring.

I like the idea of a kids zone. There ar small arcade apps that are mods for this softwatre that could be implemented for kids. A word jumble, fish crossword, download online colouring pages to do at home bring to teh meeting to be judged and get a small gidt certifcate.

A chat room in FlasgChat could be setup and it can be set for members only and or with passwords. Kids do today love the computer and are getting on it earlier and earlier in school and at home. Online is much easier for kids because when they get bored like at a long meeting they can leave.

The other thing my son posted but adults didn't communicate with him. At first it was a novelity and he got a couple replies but after that nothing so he stopped coming here and lost all interest in OVAS.

With something for kids online and/or at meetings I am sure more familes would register. I would register the young lad again because he still loves fish even shoulder surfs when I am online here.

OH I suggest these things I am also willing to help and research add ons, downloads, activities, what other clubs do, etc... In other words not just saying hey do this for us... Again just because it didn't work a bit abit ago is no reason not to try again.

OH yeah I remmeber a kids costume contest at the meeting too and they had a blast. One more thing how about once a year or twice (?) have a family meeting. No speaker no club business just a meeting with fun and games with snacks and or pizza... whay kid doesn't love pizza? LOL 

[robt18]

Kids are still welcome on the site, so the focus may have to be turned to marketing the idea rather than integrating kids into the site. There isn't anything preventing them from coming here.

At this point having a chat set up for kids would probably be rarely attended since there isn't much of a young presence in the club. Also, parents may not support their kids going online into a chatroom with other people (I feel its irrational but that's how many parents feel).

For now we probably have to start small, mention it at the meetings, have a family meeting or encourage families to come, maybe make a family membership the same price as a personal membership at the garage sale? It seems like there aren't many kids around the club anymore, so we should try to attract them first before we implement big changes geared towards them.

[Nerine]

If someone wants to help me on this project you're more than welcome to...I've been collecting ideas and things to do at the meetings...so if someone wants to nominate themself as my personal minion (evil laugh? JUST KIDDING!!!)  I'd love the help!

Send me a pm if you want to help!!! I've already got a couple...but it's going to take more than that...

Btw - there was a kid at the CAOAC convention...there wasn't anything seperate for him...he was having a blast being involved IN the adult stuff! Kids like that I know I did haha I hated being in Jr's for dog showing...the second I had a good dog, I quit that and went straight for the adults and crushed them made many enemies at that...but hey, I was in the big kid's ring and doing something I enjoyed!!! Kids want to do what adults do!

Though I like the idea of the bowl contest including kids....so parents - are you encouraging your kids to participate in the bowl contest???

[Saltcreep]

Gee, all this positive talk and ideas just might be enough to get me out to a meeting, and maybe, re-consider a membership. Still don't like meetings though.

[dan2x38]

The chat is just an idea and cost nothing takes minutes to setup. It would be password protected and could be made for only a group so a family group could be created (not visible) that is tested before going into the chatroom so only kids with a family membership are permitted. Like I said it was one of several ideas. The idea is to keep an open mind and look at all ideas.

I agree Rob baby steps K.I.S.S. there needs to be a draw in order for them to come.

Yes Nerine kids want to do adults do. My son follows me around and wants to do whatever I am doing. In the fish dept. be gaining intersest in saltwater now but still loves to feed the Malawi tank since they splash him when they feed... LOL

The Bowl Show is OK but last time there was only three entries I was one. A fish I brough suffered from stress for transporting back & forth and within 2 weeks dies... Whatever is consider needs to be hands on like this but easy enoug so they are interested and successful. If it is to 'kiddy like' I know some will not get involved. Enough though they are kids like nerine says they want to feel grown-up...

[Nerine]

the bowl show is a whole other thread...it's up to you if you want to participate or not and same for the kids...

besides maybe I'm gonna have glow in the dark gravel so don't steal my idea j/k hahaha

[holachicka]

If I remember correctly, there are door prizes for the adults - why not have a door prize for the kiddies as well...we can get a loot bag and have a draw, exclusive to the under 15 (or whatever age that is not old enough to vote) at the end. If this is acceptable to all, I can get a loot bag at the dollarstore and fill it with little "treats" and bring it to the next meeting...thoughts?

[Vincenzo.]

kids ideas ...

-i really liked the out of the club trip to, mus of nature.
-the fish tank sponsored to a school.
-kiddie door prizes are good idea too.
-maybe organize a trip down the the river.
-maybe organize a trip to a sponsor (if they allow it) to give a behind the sceens of their fishroom, or a little tour of the shop, some quick info on a few fish, something along those lines
-maybe a fish bowl contest just for kids. may it be in person at the meeting, or post it online.
-maybe at the beginning of a meeting - have 20-30min they can introduce their tank(s) and if they have any questions
-or a mini meeting for kids on a beginner setup and proper upkeep of a fish tank^


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more ideas to follow

[holachicka]

ok - seeing how there was no negative feelings towards my idea I will go ahead and purchase a loot bag - Like Nerine said to me, kids are so easy to please, something less than $5 worth at the dollarstore can work worders for kids...especially if won by a draw!!

I will keep it simple yet fun. As a little surprise, I will include a little peanut-free goodie in addition to the lootbag

[dan2x38]

ok - seeing how there was no negative feelings towards my idea I will go ahead and purchase a loot bag - Like Nerine said to me, kids are so easy to please, something less than $5 worth at the dollarstore can work worders for kids...especially if won by a draw!!

I will keep it simple yet fun. As a little surprise, I will include a little peanut-free goodie in addition to the lootbag

Hey is my ticket included in that draw? LOL Me like Loot!

[Brent Shaver]

Just a thought, but what if every time someone under 16 comes to a meeting they are given a ticket, at the end of the year there is a draw for a complete 10 gallon tank or something along those lines.

That way come once come to everyone and they all have a chance to win.  We could right the persons name on the ticket we have for the draw so there is no worries about tickets being lost.

All the other ideas are good as well but I bet there would be nothing better then seeing a young ones eyes light up as they are handed a fish ready tank.

Just an idea..

[Saltcreep]

A lot of great ideas here to make the kids feel welcome, especially at meetings. I really like the free draw for a tank idea. But, what attracts them to meetings in the first place? Assuming they've discovered OVAS through the website, what is there on the site itself that would want them to hang around and explore?  What's there to entice them to a meeting? I'm sure many of the kids of OVAS, and forum members, have already been coerced into attending a meeting. I'd like to see some of these young people, at least the ones that enjoyed themselves, given a reason to talk to their like-minded friends about checking out the Club and it's website. It would be cool to have those kids tell one of their friends with a Goldfish bowl "You should come over to the OVAS website on Tuesday after school. There's an online chat group just for kids where we can talk about your green tank".

Pie in the sky thinking, I know.

[holachicka]

Saltcreep - I agree, that would be an awesome idea.

I still think the whole coloring contest at each meeting would be a good idea - and again, there would not be any "losers", each drawing would be a winner and would be scanned at put on ovas.ca - that will give them something fun to do while attending meetings.

Why not add a 10 minute block to each meetings agenda especially for the children and have a on line poll as to what they would like that 10 minute block to be about? (10 minute is just an example, it could be more...)

I know how my 8 yr old LOVES serving people so why not have the kiddies (older ones) "responsible" for handing out the snacks - manning the tables...?! Obvioulsy, for the younger ones, not the coffee but I know both my daughters realy enjoyed helping out in the kitchen during the huge auction earlier this year... This could be a possibility - it's simple yet most children love tending to adults, has them feeling important

[Nerine]

they did a good job in the kitchen at the auction

[dan2x38]

Geeze isn't that called child labour and wasn't it abolished well over 100 years ago at least here? LOL That is actually a great idea. Kids like being helpful. Also having a place for them to post their ideas of what they would like is also a good idea... geeze two great ideas in a row... wow... And not to help your head swell even more but scanning their pictures and posting online is a great idea so three out of three...!

Kids are amazed seeing themselves or something they did online. My son's hockey team I create a website each year. Then write an article for each game and try to name as many of them each time or the next game for sure. They all get nicknames and can't wait until I post it and can't wait to see what their nickname will be. It is better than them scoring they email if I don't get the story up there in time. So articles talking about them and there first name mentioned in an online article would also be cool they love seeing there name's in lights - so to speak! 

Could even have a young member do a presentation with a slid show or something like that... There are so many ideas to me it is just take some and start. But you have to stick with it and be patient. One thing with kids is consistency once in place leave it there until it catches on. It will take time that is for certain it will likely not be an over night sensation but baby steps for success.

With all the video games, TV and any other distractions it has to grab them or they loss interest fast - am I right?

[holachicka]

I know eh Nerine - they were so cute!

And Dan - thank you sir and yes, I agree...children get distracted fairly quickly!

Let's just hope that any one of all these wonderful ideas/suggestions get snatched up and somehow gets implemented!