Volunteers Needed THIS Saturday

[Fishnut]

A number of goldfish and another unknown species of fish has been released into a creek in Kanata.  There are well over 50 of these fish.  I need volunteers that are able to help catch them all.  We need people, nets, buckets and anyone who has a pair of hip waders.

If I have enough people, I want to give OVAS some exposure on the local news.  If you're available, please volunteer here:

http://ovas.ca/index.php?topic=50744.new#new

[HappyGuppy]

I wish you all success in catching them all.  Unfortunately I cannot attend as I will be out of town on saturday, but otherwise I would be there too.

Great idea to call CBC & CTV & others to cover the story.  Might bring awareness to the "no dumping of aquarium stuff".

Question - couldn't flushing (toilet) of living fish and FW aquarium plants also cause such problems?  I remember reading in SW hobbyists living near the ocean to never flush tank water, especially caulerpa, as it gets into the ocean.  I know that many of us flush water changes (fresh water) in the toilet, and so isn't it possible that even use "responsible hobbyists" be contributing to adding alien species into our waters?  If so then I think that this aspect of the broader issue should be expressed as well.  Tank water should be dumped on lawns/gardens.  FWIW, most of the time I did dump my water in my yard, but over the years I have flushed dead fish (diseases) and tank water changes (containing plant fragments for sure), so I'm certainly not holy either - but I seriously doubt that many ovas member can claim to be perfectly innocent either.

[dan2x38]

Where does the creek run into? Is it just goldfish that need to be caught? Do you know how wide the creek is? Could a net be used? This is the reason for my questions.

[Darth]

great effort here guys I applaude you all, wish I could help but I am working sorry

[drboeing]

Im limited in my physical abilities as I recently had surgery, but if anyone has a job for me that dosent involve lifting or bending, Ill gladly help.

[Janny]

Im limited in my physical abilities as I recently had surgery, but if anyone has a job for me that dosent involve lifting or bending, Ill gladly help.

I hereby nominate you for cheerleader/spirit bunny.

[Hookup]

I think this is a great idea and gesture, but given past decisions from OVAS executives about events and gatherings not being OVAS approved or sanctioned I'm wondering where the executive weighs in on this? 

I reported the post in the other thread, not to try to stop the good deed, far from it, but to bring this OVAS representation to the attention of the entire exec.  The report was turned green, yet where is the the executive comment?  Where is the vote/geoup decision on this?

The executive should be, like in other events, gatherings, and meetings, weighing in on this.  Now that the media has been suggested to attend to represent OVAS it's a lot more critical than a simple breakfast, salty event, or web-chat yet this still goes unadressed. 

The point is why when some events, gatherings, etc are proposed does the executive step-in saying the organizer MUST publish that the event or gathering is NOT OVAS approved, yet in other cases this is not done. 

With a new executive I'm sure you do not wish to repeat the same indescressions of the past, so I'm trying to bring attention to this, first through the private message via reporting, given the timing and speed of this event, and now thru a more public venture.

Let's save the goldfish and protect the environment, but also, let's bring equally and a sense of fair play to this organization.

[Fishnut]

I'm an exec...this year and next year.

[Hookup]

I'm an exec...this year and next year.

Your point?     Is it that you speak for the entire exec?  I doubt it.   

Fishnut, you have great energy and positive intent.  I respect you and your efforts, this year and last.  I'm glad my membership money is supporting your efforts.

But common, you are not the entire exec, and they have made it clear that many events are not OVAS events...  So why is this an OVAS event, or why is it not?  I don't believe the program chair holds the sole, independent decision on this or other events...  But I'm happy to be corrected...

[robt18]

While not being an 'OVAS event' in the sense that it isn't an organized monthly meeting with ovas funding, etc, it is being run by OVAS exec members with other ovas members doing it. I think it looks great on the club and is a great thing to do! Also it gets us some exposure.

Another reason this is not and OVAS official event is liability. If someone gets hurt during the fish catching, OVAS cannot be held responsible.

Great job though everyone

[Hookup]

While not being an 'OVAS event' in the sense that it isn't an organized monthly meeting with ovas funding, etc, it is being run by OVAS exec members with other ovas members doing it. I think it looks great on the club and is a great thing to do! Also it gets us some exposure.

Another reason this is not and OVAS official event is liability. If someone gets hurt during the fish catching, OVAS cannot be held responsible.

Great job though everyone

As I said to fishnut in a resonse to her PM, I also highly support this event.   As a member, I vote yes to this, just like many other events, that OVAS should claim it is a member run club event.

However it is now clear that this is not a club event and possibly should have the thread moved from here to the lounge.


I'll offer that maybe this is a point in which the club could change past policies about ad hoc events being club sanctioned.   I understand for some liability reasons this has potential challenges, but I'm sure they are addressable.  Shouldn't the club want this kind of activity, along with the breakfasts, gatherings, web-chats and any other event to fall under the broad list of great things the club does?


One final comment assuming this is not the turning point, if Fishnut is infact successful in having the media attend and/or report on the event, what will they be told?

[Brent Shaver]

This is very much different then a gathering, it is intended soley to save some fish from entering the fresh water system due to someone elses neglect.

I believe as a club, should this bring positive attention from the media, we can help introduce the club to more people with a very positive impact.  Considering this is a time sensitive situation waiting until the next exec meeting would be too late.

That being said, as members we should be happy people are stepping up to help solve a problem that we try so hard to eductate people in.

I seriously hope this does not turn into a debate and is left for what it is,  a good natured attempt by some of our members to help protect the invasion of foreign fish or worse to our fresh water system.

Thank you to all who have and are going to volunteer in this task.

[Janny]

Far be it from me to make club proclamations, but what is the objection to simply stating that the issue came to the attention of some members of the OVAS community who came together as people with a common goal? It doesn't need to be an OVAS sanctioned event for people to come together as OVAS community members to do a little good deed.

I'm not even a member yet, so take my input however you like, but without knowing any of the personalities at play here it does seem a little like stomping feet although whether it's "fair" or not isn't my call to make.

Jan

As I said to fishnut in a resonse to her PM, I also highly support this event.   As a member, I vote yes to this, just like many other events, that OVAS should claim it is a member run club event.

However it is now clear that this is not a club event and possibly should have the thread moved from here to the lounge.


I'll offer that maybe this is a point in which the club could change past policies about ad hoc events being club sanctioned.   I understand for some liability reasons this has potential challenges, but I'm sure they are addressable.  Shouldn't the club want this kind of activity, along with the breakfasts, gatherings, web-chats and any other event to fall under the broad list of great things the club does?


One final comment assuming this is not the turning point, if Fishnut is infact successful in having the media attend and/or report on the event, what will they be told?

[Hookup]

This is very much different then a gathering, it is intended soley to save some fish from entering the fresh water system due to someone elses neglect.

I believe as a club, should this bring positive attention from the media, we can help introduce the club to more people with a very positive impact.  Considering this is a time sensitive situation waiting until the next exec meeting would be too late.

That being said, as members we should be happy people are stepping up to help solve a problem that we try so hard to eductate people in.

I seriously hope this does not turn into a debate and is left for what it is,  a good natured attempt by some of our members to help protect the invasion of foreign fish or worse to our fresh water system.

Thank you to all who have and are going to volunteer in this task.

I only see happy people, including non-members, that are stepping up to help Brent, and that is great.

As for not waiting for the next exec meeting, well in perspective it is goldfish...The dame gold fish that have been flushed, dumped and discarded since they entered the trade... Doesn't make it right, good or acceptable.   But I'm sure there are methods for emergency meeting if and when necessary, if not maybe it's something to discuss?

As I suggested above, let's use this as the opportunity to include ALL types of proactive events, using that term broadly, in the OVAS club umbrella.  Instead of excluding all non-exec managed and approved events, we could include them...

I know I drool at the idea of our club in the local news doing this good deed!  It's what I want from my club, but I also want equality.

Btw, a simple waver as part of the membership agreement would cover the club from gatherings such as these and others from liability...

[Hookup]

Far be it from me to make club proclamations, but what is the objection to simply stating that the issue came to the attention of some members of the OVAS community who came together as people with a common goal? It doesn't need to be an OVAS sanctioned event for people to come together as OVAS community members to do a little good deed.

Actually that would make it an OVAS event, legally, as you are stating the association and the founding of the idea and its relationship, promotion and subsequent existence is based upon the community of OVAS members and their interaction, without the club that would be impossible and therefore it is a club event.

And it should be!

We should get out there and get the gold fish! 

[Fishnut]

The exec are now discussing it.  Until I post otherwise, the gig is still on.

[Janny]

Actually that would make it an OVAS event, legally, as you are stating the association and the founding of the idea and its relationship, promotion and subsequent existence is based upon the community of OVAS members and their interaction, without the club that would be impossible and therefore it is a club event.

And it should be!

We should get out there and get the gold fish! 

Agreed about the goldfish and I am not trying to pick at anyone.

I should have made the distinction between OVAS Members and forum members. I do disagree that by discussing it on the forum, with OVAS members and non-member forum users it becomes a defacto OVAS event, but maybe we can agree to disagree?

[Hookup]

Argee! 

And your suggestion and bringing it forward should be encouraged.  Don't anyone let this rambling detract...  I didn't get to 2000+ posts cause I didn't speak my mind! 

[Janny]

Argee! 

And your suggestion and bringing it forward should be encouraged.  Don't anyone let this rambling detract...  I didn't get to 2000+ posts cause I didn't speak my mind! 

Great advice.

I'm comfortable sharing what's on my mind, and when I do I sometimes feel the need to add a disclaimer. 

[Hookup]

Great advice.

I'm comfortable sharing what's on my mind, and when I do I sometimes feel the need to add a disclaimer. 

Lol... I should add my own disclaimer.  "Sometimes I drink... Sometimes I post on OVAS... Sometimes I drinks andr posts in the oVrASssss...

I do have waders, and if we are not gone to the cottage I will help on Saturday too.  Infact I have a stack of four butterfly nets with 3foot poles that I could bring which are destined for the kids at the cottage...  Got them at the barrhaven dollarama.

[dan2x38]

Where does the creek run into? Is it just goldfish that need to be caught? Do you know how wide the creek is? Could a net be used? This is the reason for my questions.

OP/exec would you please address the above?

**********************************************************************************************************

I understand your concerns HookUp and support what you say. I also whole heartily support this endeavor. Maybe this event could get put off for one week for more review? I see what you are saying even through the late post time and alcohol fog... LOL your just suggesting ad-hoc events not addressed and/or voted at  exec. meetings have the same consideration of being accepted as OVAS events if OVAS members are hosting/suggesting them. Am I on target with the interpretation?  I do think the press release should get exec. approval. It is a major exposure potential and no one would want OVAS' image to be portrait incorrectly or misquoted the press can distort things quite easily.

[drboeing]

Just want to point out the heat is supposed to increase pretty dramatically this weekend, will there be enough water to keep them healthy for another week?

[dan2x38]

Just want to point out the heat is supposed to increase pretty dramatically this weekend, will there be enough water to keep them healthy for another week?

Suppose to still be lots of rain - sad but true... where is the good weather? 

If the capture is successful where will all these goldies go? They should be QT that is for sure.

[Shawn84]

On a side note the 3 goldfish I managed to catch had just past away

[dan2x38]

On a side note the 3 goldfish I managed to catch had just past away

For sure they should be QTed and receive a long acclamation before hitting a regular (cycled) tank setup. Goldfish are not as easy to care for as often thought. It is a shame how they get treated so often in bowls, flushing, filthy water, etc.

Sorry to hear you lost them Shawn84 good for you for trying to safe them!

[Fishnut]

There are still some fish there but there's MUCH more water now. Not able to see many of the schooling fish. The water is cloudy.

[Fishnut]

OK folks.  Thanks for your patience.  This is what's happening...

As of this moment, this is not an OVAS event.  It is something that I am personally co-ordinating and as a result, I don't feel it's my place to contact the media...which really sucks because the public really needs to know that releasing non-native fish into native waters is bad for the fish and the environment. 

So since this is something I am doing, anyone who is interested in volunteering MUST send me an email telling me who you are and who is coming with you.  I will give you directions to the property in my response.

EVERYONE who participates will be REQUIRED to sign a waiver, releasing OVAS, the exec and the property owner from any liability for injuries, damages to your personal property, etc. while on this rescue mission.  Technically, this is not an OVAS event but since I'm using the OVAS system to co-ordinate this, I don't want to risk any misconceptions or misunderstandings.  If you don't want to sign it, please don't go because It'll save me the trouble of asking you to stay clear.

Cheers
Sylvia

[mseguin]

2. OVAS is a non-profit organization with the following objectives:

a) to further the study of all forms of aquatic life
b) to promote interest, exchange ideas, and distribute information concerning the hobby
c) to encourage breeding and displaying of aquatic life
d) to work toward the conservation of endangered species.

Just thought I'd point out, from our constitution, why this would be considered an exemplary OVAS event.

[Fishnut]

Well it's not an OVAS event...and I got no emails, so I'm off to catch some fish by myself.

[Saltcreep]

Could someone from the exec who was involved in this decision, please post the rationale for deciding this should not be a sanctioned OVAS event?

All we can see, or read, from out here, is that a relatively new forum member picked up on a very bad situation that might be of interest to the club and brought it to the attention of the forum. Recognizing this as fitting the OVAS mandate like a glove, a club member picked up the ball and ran with it. The proposal seemed to be gaining steam, a plan was hatched, and some volunteers were jumping on board. Then, it seems, everything ran into a great tangle of bureaucratic red-tape, which resulted in one sole person out there doing what should be done. No army of volunteers, no OVAS presence, and no publicity.

[Hookup]

I think the exec was consistent in their actions.  Which is good as the alternate would be that some people can form events and others cannot. 

I'm sure at a future date this kind of "it's not an event" policy will be discussed, and maybe changed.

[drboeing]

OMGoodness this is silly!

One person found some fish, and alerted the appropriate forum.  FYI, there were 3 volunteers there to help out (I dont include myself as I was only able to observe) All I saw in this thread were a number of people with opinions but no offers to help, and it was complicated by people who apparently had no plan to assist and created the red tape.

There will likely be more situations/opportunities like this, do they really have to be debated into failure?

Moderators, if you feel Im being too harsh, please feel free to delete this post.

[Fishnut]

Yes, thank-you to the people who very unexpectedly showed up.  I arrived and there was already someone in the creek with a net and a couple of people who remained spectators...aka, fish spotters.  I guess the location wasn't a secret!!

There was no luck though.  The water had risen yet again due to all the rain.  There were far less fish than when we saw it just the other day and so many crevices in the rocks that the fish definitely had the advantage.  I can't believe we didn't catch a single fish!!  Oh well, we tried.

I don't want anyone to feel that this is the fault of the exec in any way shape or form.  This was a time sensitive matter and I jumped the gun.  In order to have something sanctioned as an OVAS event, it needs to be approved by a majority of the exec.  Don't forget that these exec positions are filled by volunteers who have jobs and kids and lives.  Not everyone lives on their computers like I do.  So, not all the exec had an opportunity to voice their opinions and there weren't enough responses by Friday night for me to call this an OVAS event.  Lesson learned on my part.

Now, no more talk about this please!  It's OVER!!  If you have any specific concerns, please PM me.

[Saltcreep]

Thanks for the wrap-up; answered my questions.