anyone try it yet? any good solid info on it? DIY info?
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/10/review/view?searchterm=LED%20light
At MACNA there was a guy, WingoLED, who had a booth and demo. I can't seem to find his website but here is a forum I think is his.
http://www.manhattanreefs.com/forum/wingo-led/ (http://www.manhattanreefs.com/forum/wingo-led/)
thx ross ima check it out.
thats expensive for such a fixture.
I just picked up a FREE 40w LED power supply from work. brannnn-spankin' new from a electritian. So now i want to test this puppy. I still need many supplies though.
This is a very good thread read it the other night, one of the better diy led write ups on rc. Seems relatively affordable and looks fun/ easy to build.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1672708 (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1672708)
vince i will get my buddy to email whos doing the diy led on his nanocube
ya u better.
I saw that on rc. But there is a better and cheaper one on nano reef's. Looks so easy to do. Asides from components u need a saudering gun + wire
we might have a soldering gun at work i dont know for sure though i will see if i can find out
but i dont even know how my buddy is doing it i havent seen it or anything i will get him to chime in on it maybe hes got pics and xxxx
The problem I have with LED lighting for aquariums is the incredible cost. Therefore, I turn to DIY which I generally prefer anyway. I just put together a DIY LED unit for my crayfish tank. It uses the new line of LED 'bulbs' WalMart is now selling. Made by Lights of America so not exactly top end but working great so far. It's a 30" tank, 18" deep with no plants to worry about. It uses three puck style lights and four mini floods like you would use in track lighting. Total cost was about $60, they produce no heat and should last about 15 years depending on the photoperiod. Not only that but, total power consumption is 10W. I'll try to get a picture tonight that shows how well they light up the tank.
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Cost and the fact they are not yet proven and other viable easier options available keeping me away for now but would be a fun project. For me it would be very important to be able to adjust colour temp but right now the only way this is being achieved is by turning leds on and off. So say 10K is all your white bulbs and 20 k is all blues (as an example)... your 15k is going to have way more par because it's got all the bulbs on... and you better hope you like the colour before you finalize your design.
Not like you can easily swap out bulbs if you don't like the colour like you can with t5's or mh.
im working on a retro for my nanocube 12. The toughest part was trying to find all the parts at a decent cost, I just received my leds last week but the royal blues will have to be sent back as they were damaged. My setup will use 13 leds total 7 royal blues and 6 whites, they are cree xre running at 1 amp, for the driver I have a meanwell dimmable wich I hope to connect to a rkl in the future. I will post some picks this week and keep you all update on the progress and testing.
thanks tony lol
was well overdue
Quote from: mikerobart on September 28, 2009, 02:06:00 PM
Cost and the fact they are not yet proven and other viable easier options available keeping me away for now but would be a fun project. For me it would be very important to be able to adjust colour temp but right now the only way this is being achieved is by turning leds on and off. So say 10K is all your white bulbs and 20 k is all blues (as an example)... your 15k is going to have way more par because it's got all the bulbs on... and you better hope you like the colour before you finalize your design.
Not like you can easily swap out bulbs if you don't like the colour like you can with t5's or mh.
You are correct, my system is not hi-tech lighting. When I want a different colour than the warm white or cool white that's usually available, I experiment with different colours of paint used to simulate stained glass. A coat or two of Royal Blue on the surface of the bulb gives a nice 'actinic' look. The stuff goes on milky but dries crystal clear. The challenge is finding out what the final colour will be based on the colour of the paint from the tube. They used to have a colour chart showing the final effect but it seems to have disappeared.
how do you know what spectrum your LED is, Cause they are not expensive at all. I have tons of LED strips I bought off EBAY for my 12V lighting I am putting in my house. It would be easy as hell and dirt Cheap to make LED aquarium lighting, But how do you know the spectrum
u want to get edison or cree led's, there is another kind to but i forget. I think the par value is close. Im gone get serious with it. And do one. They are easy, and fairly cheap to do. Im just doing some more research. Then ima do one up.
And for GOOD led's they last about 6 years the walmart special is not what ur looking for, nor are u looking for x mas lights.
Stay tuned kiddies ima make a nice one :D
I built a setup back in August using Soundwave's design from RC. I took some shots while building it and will post over the next couple of days.
In short - really impressed how bright these fixtures are and the shimmer effect is fantastic.
I use this one to supplement my dual 250w 10K XM's + 4 T5 actinics. It definitely makes my corals 'pop' more and adds a little more blue spectrum - XMs are a little too yellow for my taste, even with T5 supplementation.
^ nice, but i plan on making a pure only led fixture.
so as far as stuff goes, i called around and only spoke to rude ppl. so i need to dig a bit deeper.
here are a tone of good examples...
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=200335
so how do i find out what spectrum my light is in?
Quote from: 10gnano on September 29, 2009, 05:31:27 PM
so how do i find out what spectrum my light is in?
THAT is the first part of the LED problem. The second is, how do you know when it shifts! Anyone building these really needs to think about using something other than their eyes to measure spectrum of the light produced. PAR isn't going to get the job done either for that matter, got to be spectrum.
well i guess im just going by other peoples readings. and i hope they are right. i think led is/ and will be the new light of the future. everything will be led. even tv's now are, newer car lights, everything..slowly.
No question Vince. LED's are in all likely hood going to be the new lighting systems for our tanks. They range of application seems almost unlimited. Just at this point, we do not have any good spectral analysis of the LED systems, both at the time of inital "fireup" and at some point down the road. I would hate to shell out a few grand for an LED system only to find out that within 6months they spectrum shifted and has made the output far less effective. The going-in point for LED's is that they have such a long lifespan, their capital cost is mitigated when compared to the maintenance cost of MH or T5 or VHO systems. But the thing that you are gaurenteed to get with a "traditional" light system is a "fresh" bulb, or reset spectrum, every time you change bulbs. With LED systems we are hoping that the spectral shift doesn't happen until after the cost is recovered.
All of the data that I've seen only talks about life-span of LED's. That's like saying the MH bulb will last for 3 years. Which I think it will, maybe even longer.. but we all know that after 10 or 12 months, the MH bulbs shift spectrum so much they are detrimental to our tanks.
When it comes to LED's we just do not have the data to make me want to leap on it. It's all based upon hours of "luminance" not spectral output and shift, heck, or even PAR would be nice. :-\
very true u can have a bulb for 10years dont mean its any good. though i did read that after 7 years of a led life, it's running at 70% of it's spectrum capacity. i'll try and dig up the info. each night i go through about 20-30 pages and never save anything. so if i come across it again, i'll quote it up. plus i dont plan on spending 2500$ on a 48'' light, but rather a diy one for about 150-250$ but maybe even cheaper, since i might get some stuff for free for the project.
Hi Vince,
Thanks - the blue array I built to supplement the halides does the job nicely.
I also built a 24 LED (12 blue/12 White) setup over a 20g frag tank in the basement. Basically 1/2 of Soundwave's design. Cost me about $250ish including shipping. So far the corals are growing just as good as under my older 4 bulb T5 setup. I have both SPS (monti's) and softies growing out.
Next build will be using a dimmable ballast that I want to control with my Profilux...
I'll snap some shots maybe this weekend.
Cheers,
Greg
Not sure what LED's you guys are buying, and where you are getting them from, but what I can tell the only difference between one LED and the other is the colour of the light, and they are dirt cheap. 250 for a 24 LED setup seems really expensive, unless i am buying the wrong kind, I would love to see a picture of the ones you guys are using
They are special LED's, not the cheapos you may be thinking of + the power supplies, dimmer, reflectors....ect.. it adds up
An LED is An LED, I dont think you can dimm an LED Either, but in anycase I am going to try and build one and see what it looks like, My LED's are a very Crisp White, and I have some Blue as well
Quote from: GSM on September 30, 2009, 08:25:23 AM
I also built a 24 LED (12 blue/12 White) setup over a 20g frag tank in the basement. Basically 1/2 of Soundwave's design. Cost me about $250ish including shipping. So far the corals are growing just as good as under my older 4 bulb T5 setup. I have both SPS (monti's) and softies growing out.
Greg -
Excuse the possibly obvious question... Is there anything out there which supports 24 LED's being able to replace 4 t5 bulbs? If so, how many do you think you would require on a 48" tank.
Ross
Not sure if all LEDs can do this but most LED's I've seen can be dimmed. The ones that are pre-built into aquarium lighting actually have wicked cool controllers so you can "tune" how much of what LED's you want on in terms of 0-100% power rating... if it's too blue, just power-down the blues a bit... if it's not white enough, power those up further... very cool stuff.
There are many LEDs each with their own spectrum. The thing that I've read about is that they cast very focused beams of light, or at least some of the ones I read about do. People were using prism type devices to broaden the distribution of light so they didn't have to pack in a bazzillion of these LED's to create a uniform light source. That introduces a whole other cost issues, not even to mention the possible spectrum/output issues that could be associated with it.
Quote from: 10gnano on September 30, 2009, 02:34:24 PM
Not sure what LED's you guys are buying, and where you are getting them from, but what I can tell the only difference between one LED and the other is the colour of the light, and they are dirt cheap. 250 for a 24 LED setup seems really expensive, unless i am buying the wrong kind, I would love to see a picture of the ones you guys are using
^ u cannot use 1/4 watt leds or 1/2 watt leds, but 1watt + ..
so you are using the wrong leds.
look up>> CREE XR-E Star
^^thats what you want.
Quote from: 10gnano on September 30, 2009, 03:48:16 PM
An LED is An LED, I dont think you can dimm an LED Either, but in anycase I am going to try and build one and see what it looks like, My LED's are a very Crisp White, and I have some Blue as well
^a led is NOT a led. thats like saying all CARS are the Same.
white led you need 6500K +
Quote from: RossW on September 30, 2009, 06:03:45 PM
Greg -
Excuse the possibly obvious question... Is there anything out there which supports 24 LED's being able to replace 4 t5 bulbs? If so, how many do you think you would require on a 48" tank.
Ross
^for a 48'' fixture you want 48 leds.
.
.
.
& yes LED's CAN be dimmed.
Hi Ross,
I haven't found a study on LED vs T5 or MH but I'm seeing decent growth on the Monti's and Softies in my grow-out. No idea for clams and other more light sensitive corals.
I'd use at least 24 3 watt LED's per 2' of tank for softies and hardy sps. You can squeeze in more but it is easy to bleach corals if higher up in the tank, especially if using optics on the LEDs to focus the light. This is where dimmable option is key - it also helps set the blue/white balance. The buckpucks I'm using are dimmable.
It's the setup I was showing you this past summer - I think I had the heatsinks in the vice when you were over.
Cheers,
Greg
for that many 3w leds u will need a heat sink n fans.
Anybody check out this thread on RC about LED supplimentation? The pics are breathtaking and the cost is very low!
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1715182
I like how they are water proof and compact so you can hide them easy. Im waiting for some more photos and write ups untill i buy some myself.
Quote from: Vince. on October 02, 2009, 11:44:44 AM
for that many 3w leds u will need a heat sink n fans.
Your right Vince. You want to keep them cool so they'll last.
A few points on NOT driving LEDs at their max, and another reason for dimming drive circuits.
Running an LED at it's maximum drive current / brightness will decrease it's life and cause more of a decrease in light output and the resulting shift in colour spectrum. Drive it at 70% and get ~double the life, less fall off and far less shift. Downside, you need more LEDs to achieve the same brightness.
You can use a fixed output power source to provide the 70% drive, but if you use a variable/dimming circuit and turn it down to drive the LED array at 70%, then over time when the fall off in light output occurs you can up the drive to, say, 75% to compensate.
If your "whites" and "blues" are on separate circuits, then when the whites fall off you can up the white and lower the blue to somewhat compensate for colour spectrum. If you have an additional red/orange circuit, you can up their drive to warm up the colour temperature.
For a few: LEDs are not themselves "dimable", but we get a light dimming effect with LEDs by varying the drive current or by pulsing the drive current (from near zero to even max) at high frequency (LED looks like it's continuously on). Pulsing is great as it runs the LED at a much cooler temperature.
Cooling LED arrays:
For my design, I'm considering mounting the LED devices electrically isolated (normal mounting for these) onto the underside of a sealed Al box around 2" high and the area of the LED arrays. The box would be the heat sink. The box would have 1/4" of distilled water in it. The Al box will function as a "heat pipe", a device that uses latent evaporative pressure to distribute heat energy within it (they only work at temperatures under the pointing point of the liquid used). Like the flat heat pipes used to even thermal loads on CPUs, the heat from the LED devices would be evenly distributed throughout the box. Like the tube shaped heat pipes (used to take heat away from various electronic devices), the "heat pipe" function of the box will conduct the heat energy to all of the surfaces of the box. Add heat sinks to the top and rear of the box (sides and front if you don't mind the look) and the heat should be able to be dissipated without the use of fans (which generate noise and additional heat). The LEDs run the coolest possible and have the greatest life and least colour shift.
to much work when u can get fans that are noiseless and close to heatless. And y not run them at 1000mA. As long as u have fans and heatsink ur fine. And big deal if they burn out after 5years-8yrs. Thats 5 yrs of bulbs paid off the fixture after 2-3yrs. +what u save in hydro. And from what i have read after 5-8 yrs they go down to 70-90% from 100%, once again it paid itself off. My project is a total of around 200$. Thats 1.5 mh bulbs over 16months... Oppose to 5-8yrs at running at 100%...i think ill run my leds at 1000mA
Something I stumbled across that had cool photos and LED's... therefore it must be relivant to this thread right??? haha...
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1715182
No idea if that helps, or is even in the same ballpark as what you're discussing.. but it's got pretty photos.
ya i think its just more or less moon light. At 0.01 watt they are useless. For me putting 120 leds in a 8''x8'' impossible.
HAHA Tim look up ^^^^! Looks like im the one with lightning fast posts now. muhuhahahahhaa lol. sorry! Ya you need way too many to make true lights out of those but seem to be amazing for suppliment light at a great price!
DOH... lol... still, nice photos in that thread eh?
very nice... makes me think about going with LED's.... na, ill see how vince does in the next year with them ;)
lol. Remember kids we all have payments and sometimes u have to put that infront of this pocket burning hobby.
shmeh shmeh, If all i had was a cardboard box and my reef tank id be fine...