Hi all,
I'm another newbie. I've graduated from being a lurker because I'll be working on setting up a new 20gal tank soon. At the moment, I have a two-gallon shrimp bowl and a lightly planted, ten-gallon tank.
The 2gal has some RCS, Amanos, java fern, java moss, struggling frogsbit, algae, seed shrimp, and a some kind of lake plant. In the 10gal I have some plants that I bought at the OVAS garage sale last fall. They've been munched on quite a bit by four checkered barbs. I also have a single dwarf neon rainbowfish which came along with a plant as a fry. Hopefully I'll be able to get them a few schooling companions in the 20gal...
Due to space and cost constraints, I mostly only have experience with small-scale tanks. I enjoy trying to make very low-maintenance aquariums which tend to be on the natural/unkempt side, if someone could point me toward some threads of that topic. I've also experimented a bit with automated water changes via Raspberry Pi, so topics related to that would be welcome too.
Will try. Have you considered dwarf cichlids. Shellies to be exact. Very intelligent and interesting. No need for plants. Weekly water changes only. Give it a thought.
Mike
Hi Poisson and welcome. I keep a 20 gal tank so low maintenance that I hardly ever touch it. Been set up for 4 years, sand substrate, (never cleaned), canister filter (maybe cleaned every 6 months or so), never fertilized, only water change when minor debris siphoned out, java fern only plant, never any algae (ever), crystal clear always (always). Sound fishy? Well it's true.
But the thing that I attribute most of my success to is a home made moving media in tank biological filter. Incredible filtration method. Most hobbyist's clean there filters far too often. Do not give bacteria enough time. The moving media is self cleaning and I have not touched it since tank was set up. It takes bacteria months to multiply and get working properly and yet the majority recommend filter cleaning every month or more often. Get in touch if you would like more info. I can even send you pictures.
Bill
Mike,
I will definitely check them out. I do like plants though. My general strategy has been understocked/overplanted, though the Walstad method would be a fun route to try too.
Bill,
That sounds amazing. I will definitely need to ask you for more details on that. Do you use an automated food dispenser as well, or do you have a different method of feeding?
Welcome!
Walstad tanks work great. I'm running 2 now (and setting up a 3rd) and they're super low maintenance. One of my tanks I've been running for 6 months without a water change and ammonia/nitrites/nitrates still 0. The other I tinker with way too much so I have to do a bit more maintenance on it but its still way less than my non-Walstad tanks. If it interests you, PM me and I can let you know more about my successes/failures. BTW, less is more with dirt - that was the biggest mistake I made in the past - keep it to about 1" (some sites say 2" but in my experience that's too much - I got anaerobic conditions from it in no time). I've only been running them less than a year so can't speak to the longevity of the dirt yet.
Mike2
Just a picture of my aquarium. will get back with more.
Bill
I will ask without trying to insult. How is it possible to have 0 nitrates. It is the end result of the cycle. What test kit are you using?
Bill. Is that k1 media you are using? Always interested in ways to better the tanks seem wierd though. No matter what you do filters are part on the system. When cleaning filters bb is not lost but what you clean away is the mulm. A source of nitrates. Most bb is in substrate on glass , rocks, plants. Very interested.
No it's not Mike but same principle. It is tiny plastic beads, for crafts (necklace, bracelets, etc.) bought at Ikea. Way more area for bacteria than k1 and crazy cheap. This one is home made and has been running for about 3 yrs. and never been touched. I only use sand substrate, and java fern just sitting on top. They get so huge and heavy they just stay put. Never ever check water quality. Never ever fertilize, ever. No algae ever, crystal clear always. My tank is 18 inches high and the fern is always trying to grow out of the water. It's a slow grower though and there is hardly any maintenance. No water changes other than a little debris siphoning every 3 weeks or so. What else could anyone want?
Bill
Bill,
I've only ever used power filters, so I'll need to investigate canister filters a bit more before I understand what you are doing with those plastic beads. I would assume that any light, high surface area material can be used (small clay pebbles?), but those definitely look nice and colorful.
How do you prevent algae from growing? I've never had any luck in preventing this. I'll be trying 5 on/4 off/5 on light cycles to see if that works, but I feel like my problem is more than that. In your setup, I would guess that the java fern is big enough to steal plenty of light and nutrients from potential algae, but when the ferns were still small, did you still not have algae issues?
I've also not had much luck with keeping plant roots above gravel; they never seem to be as healthy as the plants whose roots are planted under gravel (eg. planted java fern vs unplanted java fern). I suspect that this has something to do with my system setups or water parameters, but I don't know specifically what causes the issue. I might have also just been unlucky with diseased plants, but then I would have expected the disease to spread to other plants. Is it normal to have plants that are considerably less healthy than those that are planted in a substrate?
Bill
What are you nitrates like. If you don't test how do you know it's not crazy high. What fish are in the tank. Part of doing water changes is to return trace elements to the water as well.
First Poisson......I use 2 filters, 1 Rena canister and 1 in tank homemade moving media biological. The canister uses sponge, then wool, then crushed up bbq. lava rock as filter media. The in tank biological uses the beads as media driven by an air pump via tubing from the bottom. Play sand as substrate (never cleaned). Java fern as only plant so no need for substrate ferts. No ferts. whatsoever. Java fern does not need much of anything as it's a very slow grower. Water added only due to evaporation or siphoning little debris the odd time ( maybe 2 gals). Nothing done per a schedule but only as needed. Plant size does not matter, the water always stays crystal clear. Never any algae. Two 13 watt daylight curly bulbs for 10 hours daily.
Now Mike.....I have several Pearl Danios, 2 Cory cats, 2 Dwarf Corys and 1 female Guppy. I like smaller fish. They are a lot easier to keep and produce little waste, probably part of my success. Nitrates, don't know. I do not care to keep my aquarium as per a bunch of parameters that others say I need. I don't want to know either. My aquarium is beautiful, prospering, clear as glass, healthy fish, and low maintenance. I leave it alone. What I will do though is check my water parameters and let you guys know. Got to go now, the Super Bowl is just starting!
Quote from: poisson on February 04, 2017, 10:38:17 PMI've also not had much luck with keeping plant roots above gravel; they never seem to be as healthy as the plants whose roots are planted under gravel (eg. planted java fern vs unplanted java fern). I suspect that this has something to do with my system setups or water parameters, but I don't know specifically what causes the issue. I might have also just been unlucky with diseased plants, but then I would have expected the disease to spread to other plants. Is it normal to have plants that are considerably less healthy than those that are planted in a substrate?
I've had the best results with java fern when I leave them on the surface, or attached to something (a rock, wood etc), and allow the roots to touch the substrate and they will then penetrate the substrate in search of more nutrients. I've observed something very similar with other rhizome plants like bolbitus, anubias etc. Crypts are also rhizome plants but IME they actually prefer to be burried. This is probably because there are more nutrients in the soil than in the water column for these plants, and they're all heavy root feeders. Adding fertilizer tablets also seems to perk them up.
Quote from: exv152 on February 06, 2017, 02:52:04 PM
I've had the best results with java fern when I leave them on the surface, or attached to something (a rock, wood etc), and allow the roots to touch the substrate and they will then penetrate the substrate in search of more nutrients. I've observed something very similar with other rhizome plants like bolbitus, anubias etc. Crypts are also rhizome plants but IME they actually prefer to be burried. This is probably because there are more nutrients in the soil than in the water column for these plants, and they're all heavy root feeders. Adding fertilizer tablets also seems to perk them up.
I see. I guess I'll need play around with more setups. Thanks for sharing your experience!
Sry, a little slow on the response.
I get 0 nitrates because the plant mass is consuming it (tested using API drop testers). The key is good diversity of fast and slow growing plants, enough nutrients (dirt) and appropriate amount of light. In my Walstad tanks I use low light, 60% fast growing plants, 40% slow, and generally aim for 80%+ of the substrate covered with plants. If you get a good jungle going nitrates will rarely register (unless bio load crazy high of course!). Even in my non-Walstad tanks, narrates are nil because of the high plant mass.
So I would assume that you have some plant die off then. Getting a balance that is neutral would suppose that one over the other wins. Just to be clear.
The nitrate test is the most difficult to do. Many people do not agitate the solutions and the final mix sufficiently to get proper readings. This was my mistake for many years until a fellow hobbyist showed me my error. I'm fascinated. I've even read that o ppm nitrates are not desirable. You want some for the benifit of the fish. Will have to find that research and post. Being a cichlid fancier, in the last 4 years thanks to this club I have been adding plants to my tanks. Many are growing like weeds, however I still need to change 40 to 50 % a week because nitrates are in the 20 to 40 percent range after a week. Not good for tanganyikans Great discussion.
Mike
Quote from: Bill Raley on February 05, 2017, 06:16:10 PM
1 in tank homemade moving media biological. The in tank biological uses the beads as media driven by an air pump via tubing from the bottom.
Hi Bill, what did you use to make your in tank biological? It looks like it has suction cups to fasten to the tank glass. Do you run the air tube in the bottom and vent at the top? Can you explain the construction of it?
Thanks,
Jerry
I've never heard of Nitrates being desireable for for fish - if you find the article please post - I would be very interested. Nitrates are definitely desireable for plants. From what I've read 20 ppm is a good target for planted tanks without being toxic to the fish. In my non-Walstad tanks I have to supplement nutrients - 0 nitrates is an issue and without ferts you can see the deficiencies. In my Walstad tanks I don't - the plants do great without any ferts (they get all the nutrients from the dirt). Hence my love of the Walstad tanks - no ferts, no WC's, no maintenance! And in my puffer tank no feeding either (they live off the snail population) Note: growth is slow in the Walstads so no trimming either!
Yes, I always have some amount of plant decay in my tanks. But the growth is always more than the decay and its not unsightly - older leaves die off, and get replaced by new ones. Its definitely less in the Walstads than the others. Can't say its due to nitrates though - could be lack of light (being shaded from the growth above), damage from fish, other nutrient deficiencies, etc. In most of my tanks this is desireable in order to keep the food level up for the snails (which in turn reproduce and become food for my snail eating fish!).
Yes, my tests are good. I know exactly what you mean about not doing the test kits properly - when I first started I did exactly as you mentioned! And I get readings in my other non-Walstad tanks if I go long enough between WC's.
Hi Jerry, I used an empty alcohol bottle. The one I posted is a small one I'm not using. The one in my20 gal. is larger. Drill holes around perimeter of the bottom, about eight, which will become the top when in the tank. Do the same around the top, about six, just above the cap, which will become the bottom when in the tank. Drill hole in middle of cap, snug enough to hold airline tubing, inserted about half an inch. Other end goes to air pump. Make sure all holes are a tad smaller than the beads. Fill about half full with beads. They all have to be moving from bottom to top all the time. If not, take a few out until they do. If you have an adjustable air pump, shouldn't be a problem.
Bill.
Jerry, I forgot in my previous post, but yes, those are suction cups on the side to hold on to glass inside the tank.
Also, previously I said I would post my water parameters which I haven't checked for years. PH=7.6\ Nitrate=5.0\ Ammonia=0\ Phosphate=0.
Bill
i'm no expert but those parameters seem damn good.