Planting Question

[Eric]

I managed a search of other messages, but I seem to have confused myself with watts, lumens, VHO, PAR and then all the Ts.  Sorry if this is a bit repetitive.

I have an empty 65 gallon I would like to plant with DIY CO2 and two shoplights over a glass top -- 4 x 40 watt T-12s.  I thought this would be fairly high light -- 2.4 wpg.  Now I can't figure out if it would be enough for more than crypts, val, hygro...  I would like some higher light plants I haven't had luck with before in another planted tank -- 2 x 24" T8s in a 30 gal with DIY CO2.

I was also planning to understock it and use an older AC300 (now AC70).  But I get the idea others would use a AC110 or even more.  I don't know the actual litres/hour on these.  Am I underfiltering?

Should I rethink my plan?  Thanks for any thoughts.

Eric   

[PaleoFishGirl]

1. That should be plenty of light for your crypts/val/hygro and lots of other plants.

2. You can never overfilter and you'll always buy more fish than you need   What are you planning on stocking?

[BigDaddy]

The old numbers are actually the gallons per hour ratings.  So and AC 300 is a 300 GPH filter.  With an Aquaclear or other power filter, a good target is around 10x filtration, that is to say, the total volume of water in the tank should be going through the filter up to 10 times per hour.  Now, you can do less, and that is why Hagen changed the numbering to reflect the maximum tank size.  However, as PFG alluded to, I don't think many people would want to run an AC70 on a 70 gallon tank.

2.4 wpg is not high light.  It's average.  You can grow any low light plants and most medium light plants under that type of lighting.  The plants you've listed would be fine under that light, but you won't have much success with high light plants without a lighting upgrade

[Eric]

Thanks for the info.  One more question, if I take out the glass top, will that give me much of a lighting boost?  Anyone know anything about this?   

I must be underfiltering.  I never knew what the AC numbers were.  Sounds like I should switch for a 110 or maybe use both.  I was a bit worried about too much current, but I think BD has discus, so it must be ok.

Bad news on the lighting though.  I was really hoping to try some higher light plants and carpet plants, like hairgrass, gloss, swords, lillies, or some reddish stem plants (ludwigia? rotala?  I can't remember).  I might have to try with whatever works.  I can't really upgrade lighting on this one.   

On the stocking -- glad you asked, PFG!  Its a bit complicated... I am fostering two angels in a 30 which I am replacing with a 72, hoping I won't have to give them back (they were in someone's 10!).  I was going to use the 65 temporarily, then try to find a young group of unrelated angels to grow and pair.  I also could use it as a big grow out for some swordtail fry I have.  Really, I was hoping to focus on the plants as prep for the new 72, which I think will be planted when I finally get there -- big plans, small time.  Are you glad you asked???

Cheers,

Eric

[PaleoFishGirl]

You can still grow swords and lilies, Ludwigia too... but it won't be red unless you fertilize (needs the iron)!

I only have ~2.7WPG on my tank and can grow a lot of plants fairly well.  Hairgrass will grow but not thrive.  As for Glosso, I highly doubt it would grow 

One type of plant you may want to try is Anubias - it loves low to medium light.  I have one growing on a driftwood stump, shaded by a large sword plant. It's doing very well.  Slow-growing, though, so be patient

I *think* I understand your pending plans for the tank, LOL!  I wish I had a couple of large, empty tanks to plan out for myself.  Have fun!

[BigDaddy]

Removing your glass top is not going to change your lighting levels by any noticable amount.  Which would you prefer, a 10% increase in light, or a 100% increased fire hazard? 

As far as the plants go, it would help to know if you have a 3 foot 65 or a 4 foot 65.  The height of the tank will make a big difference in what kind of plants you can use near the substrate.  Obviously, a 3 foot 65 is tall, so you need much more light for carpetting plants.

Dwarf sag and chain sword should be fine under that light, and both are good carpet plants.  As for red stem plants, try some sunset hygro, rotala rotundifolia and ludwigia repens.  All three will do fine under medium light, and will give you some pinks and reds to enjoy (albeit more as they get closer to the surface).

[Toss]

I second BD and PFG. One other thing you might consider is the placement of your tank, ie. basement, livingroom, close to window or patio door. I have 4' tank 24" deep with only 3x40W T12 workbench lighting from HD and I have problem triming my plants. Mine is 7' from patio door. For sure glosso and madagascar lace won't grow, but the other should be okay, even riccia (floating).

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[Aquaviewer]

With regards to your lights, are you going to put your shop lights in a canopy or upgrade the reflectors to direct light down into the tank?  Without something, much of your usable light is lost to the room and while you may have the potential for a specific watt/gal, the amount of effective light actually reaching the plants is lost.  Just a thought.

[Eric]

Thanks all for the advice.  I forgot to mention that its a 48" 65.  It won't get any natural light, but I may work with the reflector on the shoplights.  I should be able to hang it just above the top I think.  Good point on the fire hazard -- probably not worth it!  I was thinking of a waterhome 32 that doesn't have a glass top, but I forgot it has caps over the fixtures.
So, good possibilities.  I didn't know some of these plants were medium light (and then I thought I had higher light anyway).  PFG, I looked at your tanks online and they look amazing to me so I will work away and see what happens.  Thanks for the red/pink ideas BD.  I have missed that so far.
Cheers,
eric