Female frontosa dropping eggs...

[KarEn]

Hello!

I have a 120 Gal tank with 4 fronts and some other smaller fish. Very peaceful tank, no aggression at all.
All fish were added to the tank when they were about 1 inch in size (about 7-8) years ago.
One of my fronts started to breed just recently (about  a month ago). In about 2-3 days I noticed that she started eating again, so I looked closely - no eggs in her mouth.

Yesterday she layed eggs and then picked them up again for the second time (after about a month of the first "miscarriage"). There were about 20 in her mouth. Today - no eggs again.
What can be the problem? Why is she doing that? Water temp is stable and i keep it at 74F since day one. Tank is nice and clean, all chem level are within the norm.

Any help is appreciated.

[taim_30]

Hi,

When it comes to breeding, it can be really easy or really tricky.  I'm not a frontosa expert but I do have malawi cichlids breeding quite often.Some females take longer to learn how to take care of their eggs while others take to it right away.  There could be many factors.  What are the other fish in the tank?  Is the tank in a high traffic area?  Have you thought of removing the female and placing her in a breeding tank?

The good news is that they have bred twice from what I have read.  For now, just exercise patience and it should work out. 

[sniggir]

ask bitterman he breed fronts... man i miss haven them,,, such beautiful beasts

[bitterman]

KarEn, do you have a male in the tank? Is he even near the spawning? Females can spawn with themselves if no male is present or they do not like your current male or the male has no interest. Have your fish been vented? Are they all females?

Additionally, the first few times a female holds she often will swallow the eggs... the thing about them being gone about 3 days makes me things that the eggs are not getting fertilized. If you want to confirm this, strip the female at day 1 or 2 (before the eggs are gone) and tumble them. I use the strainer method in a 10 gallon using a seeded filter, heater and water from the adults tank. If you have any more questions let me know and I will try to help were I can.

If you have Burundi, I have some extra males and I could sell you one to hopefully kick start breeding, but ensure you have enough females in the tank If you have 4 1M and 3F is the minimum sized colony you should really keep. If you had 3M and 1F, the males might be fighting (can be just posturing amongst each other) and as a result no breeding with the female.

Bruce

[bitterman]

KarEn,
This is your tank right? http://ovas.ca/index.php?topic=11045.0

Still have the same 4 Frontosa? What one is spawning? I noticed you have 3 Burundi and 1 seven strip, Most like Kigoma as the eyestrip is nice and wide at the bottom like the variant (Does it have 7 strips on both sides? if not if could be a hybrid itself, or a genetic defect of a burundi ). Cross breeding of different variants of Frontosa or Gibberosa is not good as it results in unclean lines/crosses for the offspring. Any fry that are hybrids should not be sold, or even given away either.

Bruce

[KarEn]

KarEn, do you have a male in the tank? Is he even near the spawning? Females can spawn with themselves if no male is present or they do not like your current male or the male has no interest. Have your fish been vented? Are they all females?

- I think one them is a male. Could be two, but I am not sure. At least the big one with the hump is male and he would show the interest when the female was laying eggs.

Additionally, the first few times a female holds she often will swallow the eggs... the thing about them being gone about 3 days makes me things that the eggs are not getting fertilized. If you want to confirm this, strip the female at day 1 or 2 (before the eggs are gone) and tumble them. I use the strainer method in a 10 gallon using a seeded filter, heater and water from the adults tank. If you have any more questions let me know and I will try to help were I can.

Thank you, Bruce. I was going to strip her, but got scared and decided to wait to see what happens. The first time she layed eggs, I devided the tank into two. It didn't help. The very next day I saw all the "chewed" eggs floating on the surface. A lot of oily mess btw.

If you have Burundi, I have some extra males and I could sell you one to hopefully kick start breeding, but ensure you have enough females in the tank If you have 4 1M and 3F is the minimum sized colony you should really keep. If you had 3M and 1F, the males might be fighting (can be just posturing amongst each other) and as a result no breeding with the female.

Bruce

What I noticed was that the female had a hard time laying eggs, as besides just laying eggs, she had to contstantly escape from tailgating male(s), lay eggs and quickly pick them up, otherwise males seemed to be hunting for eggs. I thought....ok...natural selection...maybe.

I guess I would have to invite someone to look at my tank with the professional eye. I've been keeping fish for 8 years, but I'm not an expert.

Thanks for your help. Next time I'll try to stip her right away and report back.

Many thanks!

[KarEn]

KarEn,
This is your tank right? http://ovas.ca/index.php?topic=11045.0

Yes, it is. Still have all that fish.

Still have the same 4 Frontosa? What one is spawning? I noticed you have 3 Burundi and 1 seven strip, Most like Kigoma as the eyestrip is nice and wide at the bottom like the variant (Does it have 7 strips on both sides? if not if could be a hybrid itself, or a genetic defect of a burundi ). Cross breeding of different variants of Frontosa or Gibberosa is not good as it results in unclean lines/crosses for the offspring. Any fry that are hybrids should not be sold, or even given away either.

Bruce

Yes, one has 7 striped. I got them all at BigAls in 2001 as Burundis though. What do you suggest I do with Kigoma?

[bitterman]

Karen, I'll be at the meeting tonight if you want to talk... So many possible issues to deal with and questions to ask.

As for the 7 strip, You can either get ride of it. If it is a female then it might be better left in the tank depending on your ratio, but cull any fry from it. As mixing variants is very not a good thing. Suppliers often have vats of fish side by side and a fish can jump from one vat to the other. In this can I expect a Kigoma jumping in with the Burundi's.... If it have 7 stripes on both sides and the eye strip is wide on both sides it is more likely this occurred then it being a Burundi with the genetic morph producing 7 striped Brundi (This does occur sometimes, but a burundi and kigoma have different eyestrip)

Are you competent with venting your fish? First step would be to vent them all. You know the sex's it will be easier to determine what to do. That is if you are after breeding. Otherwise enjoy the fish, keep an eye on aggression and don't worry about breeding... If it happens it happens...  Adults will eat most the fry that occur.

Bruce