Don't kill yourself - GFI you tanks

[Saltcreep]

Or if your crazy like I am, change the plugs while the feed is hot   hahaha.. ************** I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS METHOD!!!!!!!! ***************

Scary thing is I know quite a few electricians and this is common practice with them when they're just changing an outlet or lighting fixture. You sure don't want to get caught by the 'labour' boys when you're doing it though. They don't look too kindly on this type of infraction.

[HappyGuppy]

So I installed two of the three outlets.   The tricky part is figuring out which outlet is the first one in the series to swap out.

Both of my kids tanks are now protected.  I am happy that as a side bonus all the outlets in the kid's play room are now protected too.  When my wife comes back I'm finishing the basement loop covering my two biggest tanks... and then I'll be safe.

Having done it I can say that it is actually fairly easy to do.  Highly recommended for everyone to have done (DIY or by handyman/electrician best).

[Nerine]

But PLEASE turn off the power my dad and father in law do it all the time without turning off the power, and like Brent, end up at the breaker panel anyways just turn it off unless you LIKE to be zapped!!

This is a good topic!!

[HappyGuppy]

I am pleased to proclaim that all my tanks are now protected. 

Before, when I was IGNORANT of the danger I enjoyed my tanks.
When I realized the danger, I minimized contact with my tanks.
Now that I have GFCI protected outlets I enjoy my tanks again like I used to.

<snip>

Please forgive the allcaps, as yes I am shouting, but in a good way...

FOLKS, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE HAVE GFCI OUTLETS INSTALLED WHEREVER YOU HAVE AQUARIUMS.  ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY IF YOU HAVE KIDS.  Even if you don't have kids, don't you still value your own life?  Hopefully in the end this will have been an minor expense that is never utilized (like insurance)... but for the few of us that might have a catastrophic tank accident (who knows if it won't be you!) this can something that you'll come to kiss those little outlets for saving your life.

[JetJumper]

I must be really crazy for building one of these and letting it zap me then..



PS:  this one is not mine specifically, but mine was very similar.

[Saltcreep]

I must be really crazy for building one of these and letting it zap me then..



PS:  this one is not mine specifically, but mine was very similar.

Cool pic. would that cause the worms to come up out of the ground?

[Saltcreep]

So I went to HomeDepot last night and picked up a few of these.  I learned something valuable, that in my mind has a few good implications.

You can install a GFI outlet that will protect the entire circuit.  The trick is to figure out which is the FIRST outlet in your loop, and replace that one.  This way you only need one outlet for all the aquariums you have in that room (on a loop).  This also means that you don't have to replace the outlet immediately next to the tank - which is good because I thought I'd have to drain tanks and move furniture around, but now know that I don't.  Also this saves money as you don't need to have an outlet for each tank (on the same loop)......

Hmmm, now where did I hear that before? Oh, yeah, up just a few posts.

[HappyGuppy]

Brent, I didn't mean for you to be offended, nor was I calling anyone stupid.  When I used to do construction I saw guys doing that all the time, and even a guy who I worked with.  I mean for anyone *reading* this post, presumably not professional electricians, to be sure to do the smart thing (aka opposite of stupid) by turning off the breaker in the basement.  For most people, again NOT professionals, who do any electrical stuff in their homes, the AMATEURS, I would consider *THEM* stupid for ignoring such a basic warning.

So please... let go of any offense that you might have taken.  Sometimes typed words don't convey non-verbal cues that change meaning, and laziness prevents us from typing everything we really mean in our hearts.

I will not take offense to the comments that I perceive that you have deliberately implied of me being stupid.  I did mention earlier that if you (the forum reader) doesn't know what to do then to get a competent person to do it for them.  You're right, do it wrong and all sorts of problems can happen, but this is not rocket science either.  Oh and I'll admit that this time I only used green painter tape to secure the breaker switch, not that anyone in my household would have accidentally switched it back anyhow.  Again, I'll simply ignore your direct implication of calling me stupid.

If you have anything further to add to the conversation then please add something constructive (pun intended) to help anyone reading this know what their options are.  I am not into flames, I posted this because I truly believed that it is useful information and that I am contributing something worthwhile to fellow hobbyists.  I will ignore any further comments of "stupid" as I meant absolutely no offense.

[Brent Shaver]

It is the word stupid that got to me, it is one of those words that rarely get a positive responce.  Your explaination was more then sufficent and I deleted my reply.

[HappyGuppy]

Brent, I am truly sorry that any of this stuff happened.  Perhaps the lesson I shall walk away with is to be a bit more careful of my choice in words... or to elaborate upon things for clarity.

As I just wrote in http://ovas.ca/index.php?topic=48490.0  I would rather have friends than enemies in our small community.  It is my intention to A) someday meet you, and B) for us to mutually like each other.

In the end I like to share my thoughts, which I hope contribute to the community of fellow hobbyists, in these kinds of forum posts.  If you look back on my history of posts you'll see that that is my aspiration - to be helpful.

I hope that we can put today's experience behind us, and to forget about it in any future interactions. 

Please feel free to delete this and my previous post above, if you feel that it would be beneficial to be gone.  I'm going to edit the inflammatory post by removing the paragraph with the word stupid in it.

[FishBuddy]

Murphy's Law prevails!

I was doing WC tonight in one of my 40G breeder tank.  I was removing the sponge of  the Aquaclear 110 located at the back.  Without warning, some water dripped out of the sponge and landed in the power bar receptacles.  The GFCI tripped right away  

Thanks God for GFCI!  I've had them installed years ago and this is the first time it actually tripped for real.  Of course, I do test them every few months or so to make sure it works...

[HappyGuppy]

Murphy's Law prevails!

I was doing WC tonight in one of my 40G breeder tank.  I was removing the sponge of  the Aquaclear 110 located at the back.  Without warning, some water dripped out of the sponge and landed in the power bar receptacles.  The GFCI tripped right away  

Thanks God for GFCI!  I've had them installed years ago and this is the first time it actually tripped for real.  Of course, I do test them every few months or so to make sure it works...

Well thank goodness you had it!  Over the past hour I pondered alternate scenarios of how an aquarium might interact with electricity, without necessarily the tank actually breaking.  Your situation also proved that point.   I am not sure how absolutely dangerous all possible scenarios might actually be.  Someone pointed out that the circuit would complete in the water and blow out the fuse / trip the switch, in the basement.  I'm sure that there must me scenarios that would be non-fatal, and even nothing negative, however I am certain that there must be specific situations, that are possible to occur, that would be fatal to a human, which the GFI would protect against.  Think about it.  We have to have them in bathrooms, kitchens, outdoors, and other places where there is the chance of water mixing with electricity.  Who knows & who cares what the exact circumstance might be for you.  Maybe you kick over a water change bucket or did something like FishBuddy did.  There are many other possibilities.  The way I look at it, with a fuse/breaker combined with a GFI, all properly installed, I believe that it minimizes the chances for something seriously negative to happen.  It doesn't eliminate all risks, but at least it can make one feel safer.

As a parent I also feel a bit safer as a side benefit knowing that I have a bunch of outlets (not all, I didn't do my entire house), particularly in the play room, are protected by the GFI.  Who knows what might cross the mind of a child.  I didn't realize the possibility of using them this way before.  I remember how a single GFCI protected multiple bathroom outlets, and kitchens too, but in my mind I never thought that it applied outside of those areas.  I just never thought much about them before.  Now I praise the inventors!

I know that I do feel safer having my extra three GFIs installed. I hope that nothing ever happens, but as FishBuddy pointed out, it can happen to anyone in an unexpected way.

[vic622]

Just thought I'd chime in with an alternate solution to changing the breaker or the receptacle in the wall -This one works for the renters.

I had an electrician friend put a GFCI receptacle in a box (like the one in the wall), wire a short length of cord & a plug. This gives me a 2-outlet power bar that's GFCI-protected.
I'll use a plastic (outdoor) box on any new GFCI-bars I make.





I had a return pump (Mag 7 to be exact) in the sump crack while I was at work. The GFCI tripped. I had no idea that there was a problem, but all my equipment wasn't working when I got home. Took a while to figure out what had happened but the house didn't burn down nor did I electrocute any fish. This was on a SW tank.

The neighbour's FW tank didn't have GFCI & while they were away a hose broke loose from a pump & sprayed water on a power bar. The power bar melted and the wood tank stand was scorched before it tripped.

I'm now an advocate of the GFCI for all fish/aquarium applications!

[Dekker500]

... some water dripped out of the sponge and landed in the power bar receptacles...

Though I wholeheartedly agree that GFCI is the way to go, there is another super-simple, often-overlooked water-electricity-safety rule involving DRIP LOOPS.

First, raise your electrical plugs off the ground. Personally I drape my cords over a cross-beam under my tank stand, so the plugin is suspended off the ground. Another option is to screw-mount a powerbar under your stand, off the ground. Note the outlet is under the stand to reduce the chance of direct spray...

Next, make sure that ANY electrical wire coming under your tank goes DOWN before it goes UP to the plug. This makes it so that any water that dribbles onto your cord/canopy/heater/whatever, it does NOT find its way to the electrical outlet. The same rule goes for plugging anything into the wall outlet. Make sure the cord goes down before up!

Here is a random google image:

And of course, here are some more creative examples (courtesy of Google)

[HappyGuppy]

Thank you Dekker, that is of course a valuable tip too.  What you described is what *should* be done with all tank electricals, and thank you for the reminder of that.

[Bob P]

Has anyone checked the codes?
If I'm not mistaken, a gfi is mandatory
outside the house, and what, 18 inches i think
from any sink.
Hot tubs, jacuzzi's are gfi breaker only. 1 meter to the
controls if they are electric timers so you get out to set it.
Ok, it's a bit sketchy on the aquarium part but
20 dollar gfi life insurance? C'mon, install them right.
That rona portable a few posts back, sure csa approved.
Only protects itself, no others in the circuit.
But that Red Green metal box extension cord?
That'll cancel life insuranse for sure.

[Saltcreep]

Has anyone checked the codes?
If I'm not mistaken, a gfi is mandatory
outside the house, and what, 18 inches i think
from any sink.
Hot tubs, jacuzzi's are gfi breaker only. 1 meter to the
controls if they are electric timers so you get out to set it.
Ok, it's a bit sketchy on the aquarium part but
20 dollar gfi life insurance? C'mon, install them right.
That rona portable a few posts back, sure csa approved.
Only protects itself, no others in the circuit.
But that Red Green metal box extension cord?
That'll cancel life insuranse for sure.

I just happen to have a copy of the simplified code right here. Here's a scan of the relevant page.

Interesting side bar on the let-go factor.

[JetJumper]

(7) G.F.C.I. Protected Plug Circuits Required - The Rules require separate G.F.C.I. protection for
each of the following outlets:
A All plug outlets - within 59 in. (1.5 m) of a bathtub or shower stall, (except washing machine
and dryer plugs in a combined bath and laundry room), Rule 26-700(11); and

B All plug outlets - within 59 in. (1.5 m) of a wash basin, (except washing machine and dryer
plugs in a combined washroom and laundry room), Rule 26-700(11),; and

C All carport plugs - See explanation below, under "Carport only Plug Outlets".

D All outdoor plugs - which are ON the outside of a single family dwelling or garage and those
plug outlets in the garden which are within 98.5 in. (2.5 m) of grade, Rule 26-714(b).

E The counter plugs within 59 in. (1.5 m) of the kitchen sink or a wash basin wherever these are
located.

Test required - To provide some measure of assurance that the GFCI protection is still faithfully protecting
us, we are asked to test each GFCI device every month, and to record the test. If anyone of them fails
the test it should be removed from service immediately - do not use a failed safety device.
Test record - The test procedure and chart that comes with a GFCI circuit breaker and a GFCI receptacle
is important. Attach this to the panel cover where it will serve as a reminder to test these special circuit
breakers each month and to record the test. If possible do the test under load with a shaver or
portable light fixture, This will confirm that the circuit is actually opened in the test. If at any time this
breaker fails a test it should be turned off until it can be replaced; do not allow it to be used.


So according to that document code does not cover aquariums.  It only covers area's that you are washing things mainly.

Also, do you keep a monthly report?

[Salt Disney]

Next, make sure that ANY electrical wire coming under your tank goes DOWN before it goes UP to the plug. This makes it so that any water that dribbles onto your cord/canopy/heater/whatever, it does NOT find its way to the electrical outlet. The same rule goes for plugging anything into the wall outlet. Make sure the cord goes down before up!

Here is a random google image:

And of course, here are some more creative examples (courtesy of Google)

I don't know much about this, but I always thought that the risk was that a heater, pump or something might break while my hand is in the tank.  In theory, I should turn off all electicals in the tank before putting my hand in, but who does that?

If water gets into the outlet or power bar it won't fry a person - could cause a fire of course - but if you are touching water and something suddenly connects power to that same water, that is where the danger lies.  The GFI trips faster than you could receive a deadly shock.  Am I right?

And, yes, I have a GFI installed at my tank.

[Saltcreep]

I don't keep a monthly report, but I do check them regularly. I have a posted schedule to tell me when to change my furnace filter - every 30 days -  and I check my GFCIs, smoke detectors and CO detectors at the same time.

I expect it will be some time before a 'Fishroom' is mentioned specifically in the Electrical Code.